083: Jesse Daniel
On episode 83, I'm joined by songwriter Jesse Daniel. Daniel just released his second album, the rollicking honky-tonk homage album Rollin' On. A California son, the influence is all over Daniel's songwriting and sound. There's a definite Bakersfield Sound influence on these highway songs, honky-tonk bar vignettes, and lonesome country breakup ballads. Here, Daniel and I discuss releasing an album in the midst of a pandemic, recording Rollin' On, the writing of the album and where many of those songs originated, songwriting on and about the life on the open road, growing up in rural California, and the revival of old school country sounds.
This episode's presenting partner is The Blue Light Live, Smith Iron & Design, and Wicker's Mesquite Smoked Jalapeno Jelly.
Interview Transcript
Note: Transcripts aren’t always accurate since they are computer automated and haven’t been edited for spelling, grammar, etc.
Thomas Mooney 0:00
Hey everyone, welcome to new slang. I am Thomas Mooney, your host, and you're listening to Episode 83 where I talk with songwriter Jesse Daniel. Jesse just released this new record called Roland on. It's a second record and it's a very falls in line with that old school kind of country revival that's happening right now. It's very much like a Honky Tonk Amash kind of album. And this is actually one of those podcasts that I had originally had slated to do in person. Back in the, I guess that first week of March, Jesse was going to be opening up for cultural wall at a two night stand at the blue light and we were originally going to do it back then. And, of course, though, all that kind of went out the window during this pandemic until we decided to just go ahead and do it on the phone. So Jesse's from rural California and you've really tell that influences all over his songwriting in his storytelling style. You hear that Bakersfield sound, it's super apparent that Jesse is well versed in the likes of Buck Owens and Merle Haggard, and dwight yoakam types and it's also like in his songwriting, his storytelling arcs. There's a lot of songs that have a very Jon's Stein, Becky and kind of ply. One of the things I like about Jesse's rolling on is that he gives the space and he allows the space for sharp and warm pedal still to be the focal point of the song. He allows that to not just be like a background instrument, or like a auxilary kind of piece, it's you can very much be the sonic focal point. The title jack rolling on, there's this really California country thing happening on it. You feel like the sharp guitars are just like, straight out of the dwight yoakam,
Unknown Speaker 1:53
or
Thomas Mooney 1:54
the blasters playbook. You know, there's they're really rockin, despite being like a country song. They're the guitars are hot. It's guitar music, even though it's country music at the same time. One thing that I dig about Jesse sound and songs is that while Yes, he is given us these old school country numbers, they occupy like a very specific feeling, in my opinion. They're highway tunes. They capture that feeling of the fast cars and they open a highway in kind of like that romanticized era of, of open highway. The songs like rolling on like I just mentioned in tar snakes in May on the mustard. There's this highway, fill this open road in this to it. Just look at the album art. He's standing there on this open highway, near a fence line. And there's these giant mountains in the background. And it's probably on a road that only the locals know. That isn't the only thing though. It's not just about the stylized version of country music. Jesse is a really great storyteller, too. I mentioned like there's that the Stein back end kind of aspects to someone's character arcs. It's these guys who just like, have lived in small town, California, and that they're like, there's this very much a blue collar ethic to them. If you listen to like the song champion, there's this very Marty Robbins, Merle Haggard kind of feel to it. And of course, like the the closing numbers son of the San Lorenzo. I really like the entire premise of that kind of song. It's very much like a self mythologizing type of song. It's Jesse salt. Charlie Crockett did something similar with the valley. I just love I like that idea of kind of doing it where you know all the songs in some shape or form. There's a part of me in it. But this one specifically is my song. I don't know. I feel like there's just something really cool about that. Before we get started, I want to remind you all about Monday night lights, to 50 song compilation of blue light songwriters that comes out Friday, May 1. It's 50. songs by 50 songwriters for $50. All proceeds on Monday night lights will be going to the bar staff of blue light here in Lubbock. As you know, musicians and bands have had to stomp the brakes on touring and shows in the live setting. Venues have had to temporarily shut down bars have had to do the same. And that just means that bar staff and venue staff have had to stop working as well, at least in that capacity. So Charlie stout called me the other day to see if I'd help him with this project, where we could raise some money to help out our friends who worked at blue light, the unsung heroes if you will. So Monday night lights is essentially a name for songwriter night at the blue light. It's the testing ground of so many songs and really the early stages of so many songwriters who come out of Lubbock so fitting that mean Charlie called up 50 songwriters who either started out on that Monday night stage who won the songwriter competition and hat just goes really deep blue ties. They know how important and essential bar staff is. And I hope you do as well. We did just share the tracklist. It's a blend of these old school kind of like classic, iconic blue light, loving numbers of this era. And then also just like a mix of new songs that haven't seen the light of day yet. I'm really excited for y'all to hear. Everything officially goes live Friday, May 1 on Bandcamp. It's a band camp exclusive. And I'll tell you why. For starters, on Friday, May 1 band camp is waiving their cut on all sales. So anything you buy, on Bandcamp, on May 1, he goes directly to the artist. And that means in our situation, every dollar spent will just go directly to blue light staff, we get a beggar cut for it. And another really cool feature on Bandcamp is, let's say you wanted to spend more money than the $50. Let's say you wanted to give $100 or $75, or whatever the case is $51. You can on Bandcamp you can pay what you want. money out whites is not ever going to be going on Spotify, or Apple Music or anything like that. So the only way you're going to be able to get it is via bandcamp. If you go to Monday night lights, calm, everything will be there on Friday, that's where you'll be able to get it by share it, all that kind of stuff. As always, I will throw a link into the show notes for easy access. And then of course, as always go ahead and subscribe to newslink. Rate us give us a five star on iTunes. Share it with all your friends and family. Go like new slang on Facebook. Give us a follow on Instagram and Twitter at underscore new slang. Okay, so that's about it here. Here is Jesse.
Unknown Speaker 7:01
Yeah, so
Thomas Mooney 7:04
it's I guess it's one of those things where I had been trying to get a podcast with you before all of this started. And you were going to be opening up this a couple of shows with Coulter here at the blue light here in Lubbock. And then all of a sudden, you know, everything starts getting canceled and getting pushed back and all that stuff. And
Unknown Speaker 7:23
yeah,
Thomas Mooney 7:24
I know, it's crazy. Finally get a talk here. Yeah, so I guess like, what has it been like on your end, as far as you know, releasing this record right before? quote, unquote, quarantine 2020. And then having all these dates, and then essentially having to cancel or push back or just have them in limbo for a long time? What's that been like for you as an artist?
Jesse Daniel 7:53
You know, man, yeah, first off, I'm glad to be able to finally do this. That's one I guess, to start off, that's one of the only real benefits that I can think of, to, to being quarantined and to being healthy, obviously unable to do to do stuff like this. But it's kind of allowed me some more time to, you know, be able to catch up on stuff like this to do talks and interviews and stuff like that with people. And it's definitely been a crazy time to release a record. For sure, it's been, you know, we had months of touring, we have basically, half of we're out on the road with Jason Boland, and the stragglers. And we're in rifle Colorado, about to play this cool theater called the theater and rifle. And we showed up to the venue got all set up, and then I guess they had called it right, then they said, the rest of the rest of the dates are canceled. And tonight's canceled as well. So we packed it up and kind of headed back and we were wondering what was going to happen and basically everything followed suit after that all the other artists and essentially, I think had about three months worth of dates. Now, if we're including all the potential stuff in in May, and who knows how long. So it's been a lot of, you know, lost income for myself and a lot of other artists. But I think having a record to promote at this time has been kind of our only saving grace. Just to be able to kind of, you know, have that to put out there. And I think from a lot of the feedback we've got from people, it seemed to have been kind of a light for them, you know, in this kind of uncertain time. Yeah. So that's been good. That's been kind of definitely keeping the spirits up is making people happy and being able to keep ourselves afloat and moving on. Through this.
Thomas Mooney 10:02
Yeah, that's such a sum, I guess I didn't really even think about is the, you know, things getting canceled while you're not even at home. Because, you know, obviously with whenever things started getting canceled, I was here at the house, you know, and I think like, you know, so much of the population was close to home when all this started happening. You know, I don't even you guys were, you know, in another state far away. No, like real actual plans of being back home at that time. That must have just been, you know, just feeling like you're just kind of caught it, like just lost in the wind or something out in the woods. Yeah.
Jesse Daniel 10:41
Yeah, absolutely. Man, it was kind of it was a little bit devastating, you know, at that, at that moment with, excuse me, all the all the dates that we'd had, this is definitely the bit the busiest year since the beginning of the year, you know, basically, we started out the year with Coulter and liking the moon pies over at Kane's ballroom. And we had high hopes, you know, were that the rest of the year was pretty booked solid. And so yeah, we were definitely pretty upset when, you know, going home and everything, but yeah, just with how serious everything got so fast. I mean, it's kind of been the best we can do. Yeah, it's just to stay home and just kind of not contribute to the problem. Mm hmm. Yeah. And
Thomas Mooney 11:36
yeah, it's weird, because, yeah, I remember you're seeing that show that you guys were booked on for that new year's show. And right, you know, at New Year's, I guess it's one of those things you see on social media, and it's been around for ever. It's like, you know, the New Year new me, and Tony's gonna be my year. And then like, every year, you know, it ends up being like, where there's something bad and people complain about what's been happening through the year. But this is like just another level of
Jesse Daniel 12:06
just stationary. I remember. Like, I remember the year Merle Haggard died, everybody was like, Are you serious? You know, 2000. Shoot, I want to save 16
Thomas Mooney 12:19
Yeah, I believe 16
Jesse Daniel 12:20
I think, yeah, you know, are you serious? 2016 then it was something bad happened in 17. You know, it's Yeah, exactly. It's like another one of those except on a whole nother level. what's crazy is that Yeah, we never nobody's in our, I mean, there's been people that are alive. Now, that had been through some crazy stuff. But I think it's safe to say for the most part, nobody's really lived through anything like this. Mm hmm.
Thomas Mooney 12:49
Yeah, it does feel there. Is this this element of feeling like, we're in a big giant social experiment? In a way, you know? Yeah, I was talking to a buddy about, you know, like, this is the part in the movie when, you know, the UFO show up to save the day, and like, it just doesn't feel like none of that's gonna happen, you know?
Jesse Daniel 13:10
Right. wouldn't be surprised, man.
Thomas Mooney 13:14
So obviously, you know, you release this record rolling on? And, you know, you said like, that's a part of a part of you thinks, you know, like, yeah, I'm glad we have this record out, something we've been working on. And it's, it's something that at least we're able to push and promote, and during this time, but is there like a part of you that kind of wishes, like you would have set back a little bit or been able to push the release date later or anything like that?
Jesse Daniel 13:51
You know, right after it happened. Right. After we basically headed home, we were set to release the record in a, you know, a couple of weeks, few weeks after. And so we were kind of, there's a couple of days, I was going back and forth. And Jody and I were talking about, like, with our team, what the best plan would be, and we ended up you know, deciding to keep the date. And I'm glad we did. And I'm pretty I think I stamped standby that just because it's I've seen a lot of people who have been, you know, pushing dates back and whatnot. And I think that's definitely smart for some people, but for us, the biggest setback was not being able to tour it, but I think that people being home and you know, really kind of looking for something, you know, something to kind of listen to something to grab on to right now has kind of worked to the benefit of people releasing music. During this time. I don't think obviously it's as good as if We could have been out there hitting the road hard right now, but I think I think we in our team did like the right thing. Was that way better than I could have hoped for? I was pretty skeptical, you know, with releasing her record in the middle of a pandemic, but
Thomas Mooney 15:17
yeah, have you? I guess, like, have you ever done plenty of the, the the Instagram, Facebook, kind of live live things to at least, you know, continue play in somewhat somewhat regularly, you know, I'm sure you always kind of have a guitar at hand anyways, but do you? Does that kind of give it a little bit of normalcy in a way to at least be able to play these songs live and, quote, unquote, in front of people?
Jesse Daniel 15:47
Yeah, definitely. That's been another big one to get used to. The first couple times, we've done some live streams, just on my own account, and then we've been a lot of companies and publications have been like asking artists to come and do like page takeover, page takeover style, live streams. And like, we did one with the boot. And we're doing one boot barn tonight, actually. And they've been cool, man there. It's definitely different. It's weird seeing, you know, a bunch of comments on the stream, or on the screen, you know, and you're just streaming it to these people as opposed to being right there in front of them. So that took some getting used to, but I think that's been something that's also really cool. You know, about like, the day and age that we live in is we're able to connect, just like you and I are talking right now. You know, we're hundreds of miles away, but we're able to, to connect, you know, in a way, even in spite of a, you know, virus, it's taking hold of the planet.
Thomas Mooney 16:57
Yeah. You know, it's kind of funny is, you know,
Unknown Speaker 17:01
the,
Thomas Mooney 17:04
in a live show setting, it's like, most of the time you want the audience to not just be screaming and blurting out stuff, and you know, it's probably like the exact opposite during during this because you're like, at least say something on Instagram. Like,
Jesse Daniel 17:19
you're like, man, I miss the heckler.
Unknown Speaker 17:21
Yeah.
Jesse Daniel 17:23
Yeah, no, I definitely. Absolutely. It feels kind of the the first two times that I did a live stream felt very, when you hit the little last tag of the song will Darren de lado elite. Did you expect the clapping or people to do something? You know, it's just silent. Yeah. It's kind of a little bit of a weird thing. But yeah, it's been it's been pretty cool, though. Oh, no, I'm glad we're able to do that.
Thomas Mooney 17:51
Yeah. Obviously, we've been talking about all this, but like, this is all revolving around, you have in the record? You know, you I guess it was like last year, you started really unfolding the layout of like, Hey, I'm going to be releasing a record yada, yada, all that kind of stuff. Like, what's the what was like your, your game plan going into to recording rolling on and, and just getting all those songs collected and ready? What was kind of like that, I guess, getting all your, your T's crossed, and I's dotted as far as like, what you wanted as a, a an idea for what this record was going to be?
Jesse Daniel 18:36
Right? I'd say, you know, we had a pretty clear vision. In 2018, I released my self titled record, and that was, by comparison, that record was a lot more. This there were songs that I've written over a long period of time, that was kind of my first introduction to really, you know, cutting a full studio record, like by myself and doing that. And this one, as far as the songs go, it was a shorter amount of time, but I'd say probably a more inspired amount of time, you know, when when writing these songs like there's there's a lot of inspiration and a lot of kind of desire to get them out to, to people. And when we basically decided to go with found out about Tommy data more who we did the record with through just listening to there's a Jim Lauderdale record. This changes everything. I really love the production on that. And that last dug some record also, that Tommy worked on, among a bunch of others. I have this batch of songs basically. And I knew started kind of toying with the idea that I wanted to get somebody to co produce it. With me, and after kind of going down the rabbit hole on Tommy, I basically just shot him a cold email and pitched the whole thing to him. And he was into it. So that kind of set everything in motion. And from there, yeah, we launched that Kickstarter campaign to basically just as like a pre order for the record, and that went really well ended up getting the whole record funded. And studio wise, it was, it was pretty incredible. Like, just how quickly everything rolled and how the band that played on the record was really able to just capture exactly what
I had kind of envisioned for each song. So it's definitely the most fun I've ever had making a record.
Thomas Mooney 20:48
Yeah, you know, you mentioned that your first self titled record there. And then I guess, you know, like, the, the, it's interesting, you say, like, the, the excitement of wanting to get the songs out, I guess, like, you know, I've not really ever thought about the, the, the momentum aspect of, you know, having I guess, like the being a little unsure The first time you put a record out it or the song isn't gonna sell or people gonna buy and then, you know, once, once you do get a little bit of some buzz, if you will, you know, you're, I guess it does add to the entire excitement of getting these songs out. And if there's one thing on these songs, there's a little bit of like that, you know, pressing forward, I mean, like rolling on, for example, it's just like that, that right? example of, of just moving forward, you know, and moving up, and right, a little bit more of a, an optimistic kind of sound and everything even.
Jesse Daniel 21:51
Yeah, definitely, man, this, this record had a lot of a lot of that forward momentum, and kind of, you know, a little bit more of a positive message and spin and that's, that's kind of where I'm at, or at least that's where, where I'm at, and especially where I was, you know, at the time with writing those, like, I'm glad that we were able to kind of musically capture those the band, you know, they ended up giving a lot of energy to the songs and that's really what I had in mind for him. And I think that if it would have been a little bit more stripped down, it would have lost that.
Thomas Mooney 22:35
Yeah, yeah. Like the songs are very much. You know, the, the big kind of 50s country 60s kind of Bakersfield, San you. I mean, you mentioned Merle, a minute back, you know, like that California, kind of just that golden era of country. It's very Oh, yeah. In that same vein.
Jesse Daniel 22:58
Yeah, I love all that stuff. Man. That was a huge that was another huge influence, you know, that I told these guys, they were all kind of joking around with me when we went out to cut it with Tommy, that I had to come all the way to floresville, Texas to cut a Bakersfield record. And it's, it's cool because they all were you know, they're huge fans of, you know, Buck Owens, and I feel like there is a lot of sense you know, guys like Merle Haggard and Buck Owens were doing their thing back. Yeah, 50s and 60s. They really made such an impression that you know, you can hear for instance, like Don Rich's all of his guitar signature guitar licks, you can hear those on records from like the 70s 80s especially the 90s there's a ton of 90s country that really kind of emulated that and so that made such a big kind of impact on me in the way that I play. I really wanted to represent my home state and that that form country that I love so much.
Thomas Mooney 24:05
You mentioned Jim Lauderdale. I guess it was like probably like eight years ago, I saw this show during south by that it was like the like the bill it was one of those bills where it was just completely stacked where it was him and buddy Miller playing together. And I think like if I can remember the the the lineup it was I know Steve Earle played a set and nice
blinking
but like I walked away with like, buddy Miller and Jim Lauderdale is just kind of being like, the best show I have seen like that weekend kind of thing. It was just so and I remember they open that show that Oh, and it was just like, you know, just the, the chemistry between those two guys but then also Just the sound was just so spectacular. You know?
Jesse Daniel 25:05
That's awesome. Yeah, I haven't gotten to see him live, but just the songs that he's written and, and his voice is pretty incredible. You know, you can do so much with it. And, and just the, you know, production on a lot of his records I really like.
Thomas Mooney 25:22
Yeah, there's a lot of, and it's the same thing with with buddy too. There's a lot of just dynamic stuff happening. You know, it's very, like I hate to say it's like very meat and potatoes, but in a way, like what they do is it's there's not like all this. It's very organic. You know what I mean? There's not a whole lot of just extra unnecessary stuff, but what you know what, what they're doing is the stuff that they do have is just like, right there, up front, and just really good. You know it and I think like, you know, we talked about, like, 90s country, when people talk about 90s country, you know, you think of like George Strait and Garth Brooks, like, there's that underlying that I don't know, whatever the the next level of of guys, is that right? Right. had so much of a big impact on the sound to
Jesse Daniel 26:17
definitely, man Yeah, I feel like if we're talking about the same thing, I feel like some of those guys like, like Rodney crowl Hmm. You know, he, to me was always kind of more like a, like a songwriter, songwriter. And then I hadn't really been introduced to a whole lot of his like 90 stuff other than like, the couldn't leave you if I tried like, I knew that song. Yeah. But you listen to the production, you know, that really was like that quintessential 90s country sound. But uh, but yeah, I feel like they were like the next level from from the Alan Jackson's.
Thomas Mooney 26:55
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Unknown Speaker 29:05
Now back to the show.
Thomas Mooney 29:11
The bet, obviously, like there's the the aspects of the how like we're country's gone to in the last decade or so just like kind of like that homogenized sound of of country and pop and hip hop and rock and roll are all like the same thing. But
Jesse Daniel 29:29
yeah, you know, there
Thomas Mooney 29:31
is there is that revival I was wanting to ask you about you know, there is guys like you in the moon pies and Coulter and, you know, there's a lot of these guys that are coming around right now. I mean, like Jamie why, like a lot of what I guess you would call like a revival of an older style of country. Do you think that like it's happening because, you know, it's just like the the ebb and flow of country music as far as like what's quote unquote popular geared towards the masses or do you think like, there's I guess like, what is your opinions on on? On the, I guess the revival of a, quote unquote classic kind of country style?
Jesse Daniel 30:14
Right. I think yeah, it's interesting I think that there's definitely you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of people that have and I used to kind of think more so like this that have this kind of, like, I think a very adamant like hate for anything that's not like classic country, you know. And, and I definitely used to be a little more like stuck up and whatnot, I've tried to really kind of open my mind to possibilities of things, kind of growing in different directions and people you know, doing what they what they want to do and making what they want to make, and I respect that. But on the other hand, I it makes me really, you know, proud and happy to be a part of the kind like you said, the kind of revival that I feel like is going on right now. I think, like all those artists you mentioned. There's a cool thing happening right now. And that was, I remember, I was talking with Coulter at that this last show we did or I did with him at the Orpheum Theatre in Flagstaff, and I was telling him that I thought it's funny, because I was telling him I thought that I was like, man, I got a great feeling about 2020 gonna be a great year, he was like, yeah, you think so? I was like, Yeah, man, I think it's gonna be the best year, you know, for, for this type of music for you know, country music and just kind of authentic stuff. And we were kind of talking about that. But in spite of everything that's going on, I think that there is, like you said, kind of a cool new interest in that. And I think that there's a lot of younger people who are kind of perking up to the idea of it being cool. And interesting to not just follow along with like, you know, the trends and whatnot, what's on the radio? Which, which, yet, if that becomes cool. Who knows? Eventually, maybe that'll be the mainstream who, you know, you never can tell. But I think it's cool that there's an interest in it for sure, man, I'm glad honored to be a part of it.
Thomas Mooney 32:31
Yeah, you know, it is one of those things where, you know, I also I felt like I was, you know, real pretentious when it came to, this is what country music is, and this is what it's not and what you guys are doing is that country? Yeah, that whole kind of thing. But that kind of gets tiring. You know what I mean? Like, you're like, you realize, like, that is exhausting being that guy. Like, you know what I mean? I guess like one of my deals is just that, you know, it sometimes it goes too far in that direction. And it pushes out all of the other diverse, the diversity in country music, because they're like, you know, there is a lot of other you know, I guess, movements in country that sometimes gets those fires get stomped out if everything's a is just bro country or you know what I mean? Like in
Jesse Daniel 33:25
Right, right.
Thomas Mooney 33:26
If there's anything that needs to have like a revival, it is like, you know, this this kind of country?
Jesse Daniel 33:32
Absolutely, man. I agree. You know, you
Thomas Mooney 33:36
mentioned just talking with Coulter, like how much do you you guys, it's not necessarily even culture, but like, how much do you guys feed off one another? Is there like even, you know, a, an aspect of of being influenced by contemporaries?
Jesse Daniel 33:54
Oh, I'm not sure. I mean, do you mean like me and culture just kind of peers in general?
Thomas Mooney 33:59
It appears in general.
Jesse Daniel 34:01
Yeah, I'd say like, definitely. Like on that for me on like the inspiration factor. You know, one of the guys for me that was always a big inspiration in the end, like the hustle area, like I always really appreciated his hustle and his drive was Charlie Crockett. He's just always, always out I mean, ever since I met him, this is a few years ago now. And then we did some he took me out on tour, opening up some rounds of shows and him and his whole crew just were Yeah, very driven. And also like pretty, pretty positive and nice and kind of people and took time to like talk to fans and stuff. And that made you know, a big an impression on me and kind of if there is any doubt in my mind of like how to do things a certain way like getting to see guys like that, that I looked up to doing it like that. That's you know, That's just that's such a cool thing to be able to, like teach generations that way just by leading by example. Excuse me. And so yeah, definitely, I think, you know, for me in that way, just by kind of seeing the way people are doing things and respecting their, their hustle, you know, yeah, musically, also, you know, I love so much of my peers, music, you know, that they're putting out it's cool to listen to. Yeah. But I think that the cool part of the cool thing is to be able to all we obviously are kind of drawing from a similar well of like, love from that traditional country music. And it's interesting to see everybody's interpretation of it, you know?
Thomas Mooney 35:51
Absolutely.
Jesse Daniel 35:52
Yeah, super inspiring. It's,
Thomas Mooney 35:54
it's also interesting, because, you know, the, you know, just thinking about, like, of previous generations of country, or just music in general, so much of your peers are, you know, far away, and there's no real way to get ahold of them, unless, you know, you're on the road together, or, you know, that's why like, everyone kind of lives in Nashville, or Austin or wherever, but now, you know, like, you're able to keep up and keep tabs on everyone, via social media, you know, it's easier to see more of the inside in people's lives and like, just even, you know, just messaging them or like commenting. There's a lot more ways to interact with with your favorite artists, but, you know, artists, with other artists, you know, like, there's just so much more interaction, and I think that definitely has had an impact on you know, the way music sounds you know, what I mean? It is it's also interesting how you're talking about
Unknown Speaker 36:59
the
Thomas Mooney 37:02
the interpretations the the various interpretations of, of everyone's favorite old music, you know? Right.
Unknown Speaker 37:12
Go Yeah, go ahead.
Jesse Daniel 37:15
No, I was just gonna say yeah, exactly, man. Yeah, that's it is super cool to see.
Thomas Mooney 37:20
What I was gonna say was, like, going back to the the songs of rolling on. You know, obviously, you kind of mentioned a little bit before of like, how the first record, you know, all those songs were from a for like, a bigger piece of time. The songs like right here, like what, like, what, what's, what's the oldest song on here? What's the song that is probably like the just like the oldest of this bunch.
Jesse Daniel 37:45
I'd say the oldest of the bunch is only money, honey. That one is a duet I do with Jody. And we actually wrote that one. I think that's the only one on the record. That's like a few years or more or less like for three and a half, four years old. We wrote that one. When we first got to Jodi's, by the way, she's my partner. And she also manages the group and kind of helps co run dietry Records. That's our label, we started. And we basically just kind of run the whole ship together. And we write a lot also together. So she and I wrote that one. And it was during Yeah, basically just a time when we had a lot of overhead and a lot of crazy odds stacked against us. And we were feeling pretty underwater as far as just life goes in general, and money and whatnot. So that song was really kind of born out of that desperate time, we actually wrote it in the dark. When our power was out, we lived way up in the mountains. And when we lived in California, we live way up. And a tree had fallen and blocked basically our way into town, and also cut the whole power to the whole area. So we're just in the dark for about a week hanging out up up there. Yeah, and ended up writing that song.
Thomas Mooney 39:20
Yeah, that's a that's for for people here in Texas. I mean, that that sounds like real trees to me, like,
Jesse Daniel 39:28
yeah, huge, huge redwoods.
Thomas Mooney 39:30
They're massive. It's one of those things where like, you know, I grew up here in West Texas, and, like, there's no way in hell. A tree would be able to block your way anywhere.
Jesse Daniel 39:43
Right? Yeah. And that's, I know I used it when I was young. Growing up in the mountains like where I did, I always felt so kind of claustrophobic stuck by the trees. It's always kind of under this canopy. It feels like and Whenever I drive through, you know, the desert or when I got go to Texas a couple times, like I loved driving into West Texas or like, you know, Arizona, New Mexico, I loved wide open spaces. So that was something I felt like I never really got growing up.
Thomas Mooney 40:15
Yeah. I've always loved the love that aspects you like there is this. I was trying to tell us somebody didn't really kind of, I feel like they were skeptical, skeptical of what I was saying. But I was like, yeah, just the there is this aspect of being a little bit claustrophobic in other areas, because it just feels like like everything, just kind of just too much stuff around, you know?
Jesse Daniel 40:43
Yeah, like I live. Yeah. If you were to live in, you know, New York City or some place like that I have so many friends who live there. And my hat's off to him. Because I went, we did that one of the shows I did with Jason Boland, and the stragglers played at this place in Manhattan. And just trying to find parking took me about two and a half hours. Yeah, and it's pretty, pretty wild feeling. So it's crazy. This country has a lot of different different landscapes. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 41:17
I want to get back to, to old, only money, honey, but I want to ask you first, because you're talking about New York, when you have to like when you're touring around places that are like, you know, those these big urban sprawls or like, metro areas, how much more planning has to go into, you know, just finding parking and stuff like that? How much is there more? More? I guess, like, planning aspects of your trip?
Jesse Daniel 41:47
Yeah, definitely. I think that was something that I didn't ever really. I didn't grow up. I grew up in a really small area. And, you know, we go into the city, the closest big city test was San Francisco. So we go north to San Francisco. Every now and again and that so when I had an idea, but I never really knew what it was like to be touring and trying to park a van or, you know, bigger in a place like that. But yeah, it definitely adds adds a layer of complexity. My, my driving rage has gotten a lot better than it used to be. So usually, when we get into the city, I just have to take some deep breaths and wait till we find that parking.
Thomas Mooney 42:36
Yeah. Yeah. Going back to the the song, how much has this has a song changed from that? Like original? first version, that first draft that you guys were kind of working out? Did? Has it changed a whole lot or morphed into something else?
Jesse Daniel 42:54
Yeah, yeah, we always wanted it to be kind of a walking shuffle. Step real classic country kind of walk in shuffle. But it definitely evolved once we got it in the studio with the band and we worked it out and ended up you know, kind of arranging all the harmonies with fiddle and steel and everything else, and that it really came to life when we did that. And it was kind of one of those songs that we didn't play all that much live at all until we recorded it with the band. And then we ended up adding it to our you know, our catalog and played now we've been playing it for a while. But uh, it kind of took getting it down with the band before we could really bring it in.
Thomas Mooney 43:40
Yeah, kind of found its way
Jesse Daniel 43:42
back we it kind of came into its own.
Thomas Mooney 43:44
Yeah. How much do you on this record? Did you? Did you feel like were songs where you had a specific idea? And you wanted it that way? Or was it more of a? Let's try it? Let's kind of like be a little bit loose and see what what the song? What happens in the studio? You know, what, what kind of approach Did you guys take? I'm
Jesse Daniel 44:11
definitely kind of a control freak when it comes to my sound and everything and how I wanted it to sound and Tommy, he was joking around. He was like, I didn't know that we were co producing this thing when we first started. He was like, you know, just joking that I kind of took the reins and whatnot. But we ended up working really well together. And he was if there's something he was adamant about, you know, like if he didn't hear something there, he wanted some level different he'd really put his foot down and be like no, I really think that this is the way I think it would sound best. Let's just try it. You know we do that but for the most part, it was great. Because I was kind of able to I had a pretty precise vision of like what I wanted and they were all great at being able to just knock that out.
Thomas Mooney 45:01
Yeah, the Did you ever watch that? Jimmy? I've been and Dr. Dre documentary? Like it was on HBO a couple years. I
Jesse Daniel 45:13
can't remember. No, I don't think so.
Thomas Mooney 45:16
The reason I bring it up is just simply because, like, Jimmy, he started out like as a engineer, and you know, he worked on all these, like, really cool records. But he talked about, like, how frustrating it was working with Bruce Springsteen. I guess he had, it was on the record, darkness on the edge of town. And he engineer on this record, and and, like, Bruce, apparently, just, you know, just being really, really difficult in the recording process of like, hey, let's try this out. No, no, that doesn't work. Let's try this. And like, just, like mic placement kind of stuff, you know, that kind of thing. And, and I guess, like, the producer, took Jimmy to the side one time, and was just like, hey, if you just just do everything he says, and, you know, you're gonna find a friend for life kind of deal. And this, I guess, this quote that just like, really, I just have always remembered, and it was from Bruce and he was like, me as the artist being in the studio. Like, this is a time for you to indulge me. And so I expect everyone to indulge any idea that I have, or like, you know, just to find the right thing. And right, you know, I think there is probably like, that's probably like, a little too far. But
Jesse Daniel 46:45
yeah, I mean, yeah, you could argue that that's maybe a little on the pompous side, but i but i think that's awesome. At the same time, like, I think that's true. And, and that's where like that, that's kind of what I meant by like, Tommy. Yeah, as far as like, Mike place fit and all that, like the stuff that he truly knows. I don't know anything about that. But he, he basically took care of everything like that, and then facilitated everything else for me, kind of let me you know, have that creative control to be able to really kind of play around with different ideas I had. That's funny, though, man. That's a cool quote.
Thomas Mooney 47:23
Yeah, it's a I can't remember the documentary. I think it was called the Defiant Ones.
Jesse Daniel 47:29
It was okay. I got to check that out
Thomas Mooney 47:31
a couple of episodes about their their partnership and like, I guess, like the way the way they came up in the music, business and but like, it's, it's really interesting. I think, like, my favorite part of that documentary was how, in a lot of ways this is just like, worshipping Jimmy and Dr. Dre for being geniuses, you know what I mean? And so, all these artists who they've worked with over the years are just kind of like, giving them their their dues and praise. And the only one who really ever had any pushback in the interviews was Tom Petty. He was just kind of like, you could just hear the eye roll every and everything he said, but it was so fun he was but he you know, it's Tom Petty
Jesse Daniel 48:17
hilarious.
Thomas Mooney 48:18
But this episode is sponsored by wickers musky smoked jalapeno jelly. It's owned and operated by my buddy West wicker, who makes the jelly in small batches for the best quality and freshness. He smokes the peppers with mesquite and uses pure cane sugar to make the jelly. What you get is this great blend of smoky sweet and spicy. It's addictively savory, for those uninitiated, workers is a great addition to any chef's kitchen. Part of what makes wicker so great is just how versatile It really is. For starters, it makes a great meat glaze, throw it on a batch of hot wings, use it on some pork ribs, some pork chops, really whatever you can think of it on biscuits, cornbread, bagels or toast, throw it on the ham or turkey sandwich. Another super simple but effective way is to get some cream cheese, throw some workers on top and then grab your favorite cracker. wickers is currently stocked at a handful of places in Lubbock and on the South Plains, as well as some Fort Worth in DFW locations. But the easiest way to get your hands on a jar is to head over to wickers tx.com. That's w i c k, e r s t x. com. I'll throw a link into the show notes for good measure. They currently come in two varieties, original and now hot. If you need just a little bit more kick in your bite. You can order anything from one jar to a case a 12. whatever fits your needs. Again, that's wickers tx.com. Okay, back to the show. The songs when it comes to like song grind for you is are you a, somebody who needs like the, I guess, like being at home in that space? Or are you able to, you know, pick it up and, and take songwriting on the road and, and kind of ride on the road and write in various places. what's what's kind of your style?
Jesse Daniel 50:21
I've definitely written on the road before. But I think it's definitely I think it's more comfortable for me to be at home. I usually find that when I get back from being on the road, or I have kind of a moment to decompress, then I'm able to, that's when I usually feel most inspired to start writing. And it usually just happens from picking up the guitar and playing around or, and having a pen and paper handy. But yeah, being on there, it's hard. I, I've always wanted to be that guy who's, who comes off the road with a new record or whatever. But it's, I think, because of all of the Jody and I are basically doing with running the whole show, and making sure we're like getting orders shipped from the road and like doing kind of all these different things driving. It's a little hard to feel creative. In between all that stuff and the actual shows themselves. Yeah, that's something I definitely want to, you know, get better at is being able to find that space and kind of do that while on the road. But for now, yeah, just writing at home has been cool. I love now, we have all the time in the world we've had, I've had the most time at home that I've had for quite a while. Yeah. And I've ended up writing a whole lot more. I've got just about just about another records worth of songs that we're going to be hopefully getting into the studio sometime later this year with
Thomas Mooney 52:00
Yeah, well, that's exciting, too. I mean, like, there's nothing quite like getting a record, right out of a pandemic, you know?
Jesse Daniel 52:08
Yeah, the pandemic sessions, baby.
Thomas Mooney 52:12
Yeah, it is weird having like, I think in, in, in theory, it sounds great riding on the road, but then like, you just realize just how little time there is, you know, there's just like, smaller pockets of time to actually do exactly. If you're not like, if you're not, you know, Springsteen, just because offhand, you know, like, Who's got like, you know, every there's, everyone's doing all the other jobs, you
Jesse Daniel 52:43
know, he just has to sleep and drink water. Like, yeah, yeah. And show up.
Thomas Mooney 52:48
I'm sure. Like, there's plenty of time for him to ride on the road. But you know, when you're having to, you know, drive the van, find that parking in New York City. You know, ship wreck. Yeah, I don't know, that kind of stuff. It's, you know, it just takes time.
Jesse Daniel 53:05
Absolutely, man, it does. But I that's something that the aspiration of mine for sure, I want to one day, I want to be riding on that bus, you know, laying laying in my bunk and being able to just write for hours and hours. That'll be that'll be awesome.
Thomas Mooney 53:22
Yeah. You. You mentioned pen and pad. Are you like, uh, do you like to write in pen? Are you kind of a mix of, of technology and old school, like actual, you know, notebook style?
Jesse Daniel 53:37
Yeah, usually, I have a few notebooks going that, that I usually do just like a composition book, or whatever. And I usually write just out of those, and we'll write down ideas. But if I don't have anything like that, I have my notes on my phone that also fill up. And the only problem with the phone, I feel like is you have to go back so far as so many in there. But for whatever reason, it's almost easier for me on a piece of paper to like flip to this page or that page. But I do both definitely. Yeah. Like I have probably like 500 You know, sometimes I'll be driving and I'll get some inspiration. And I'll just hit record. So I have hundreds of weird out of context sayings and things like that.
Thomas Mooney 54:29
Yeah. The it is a luxury to have like that. That technology right there at hand to be like, hit record. Here's this idea. But I yeah, I can imagine Absolutely. How easy it is where all of a sudden you you do have just like you're overwhelmed with notes when you try and look back through.
Jesse Daniel 54:52
Yeah, exactly. Man. I think I prefer the the writing method but yeah, pretty much lucky to have phones that knology helps.
Thomas Mooney 55:07
You know, like, what is what's kind of like your, like your when you think like, Oh, yeah, I need to record that saying or like write it down in. Even like the Notes app or something like that. Is there like, you ever just hear people say something or even like that? And you're like, that's a potential something or another?
Jesse Daniel 55:28
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, man, that was when Jody and I first got together, her dad, her dad passed away, before we were together, so I never got to know him. But you know, her and all of her family, like he was a very, really funny guy, and had a saying for everything. And one of the things that you'd always, you know, say to Jodi, basically, when she would be driving around is like, kind of a rebellious teenager. He tells her to keep it between the male and the mustard. If she was, you know, driving it, like, all right, well, make sure you keep it between the male and the mustard. And I always thought that that was really cool. And I think that was one of those moments where I was like, Hey, would you say, and I had to kind of go back and make sure I got that one down. Yeah, the I definitely do that.
Thomas Mooney 56:25
Yeah. I was gonna ask, too, you know, like you just said, you were you've been writing is, uh, how many like songs do you typically try and, you know, push for? Is there like a magic number for you? As far as like, I want to go in with X amount of songs knowing that I'll cut down to 12 or something like that. Is there anything like that? Or is it just kind of just, you know, just playing it by ear? I guess?
Jesse Daniel 56:53
Yeah, this was rolling on, we went in and had I think, in the demoing process, we had some demos that I did beforehand, and we ended up cutting, I think one or two off of that. But when we went in to actually cut the record, we had a really clear idea of like, how many songs is 12 songs and, and I kind of liked to do that a little more, because I think it I don't know, it almost feels more secure, like you know exactly what you're doing. And that way, you're not putting time or effort into something that might not get used, or there's also the kind of fear that if you record it with this batch of songs, it might not fit into the next record, because of this, the sonic difference or whatever.
Thomas Mooney 57:45
Right? Yeah,
Jesse Daniel 57:46
so I've always kind of strayed away from doing that, but that is something I've been interested in. And I think it's definitely cost effective to go in and cut. You know, if you're in the studio already good. And cut a couple extra songs on the off chance that you'll use them.
Thomas Mooney 58:03
You know, you mentioned growing up in a, you know, rural county in California. In a little bit of a, you know, a small town, kind of, I feel like that's kind of, I think a lot of people think of like California has been like big city and like that's it but there are these like, you know, big areas of just, we're just rural small town stuff. I guess. Yeah. Like how much did did growing up in California have like an impact on on not just your, the the sonic qualities but like your your storytelling aspects of telling stories.
Jesse Daniel 58:44
Right. Definitely plays a huge part. There's Yeah, California has, a lot of people don't realize how huge it is. I mean, it's 800 plus miles of, of coastline, you know, that basically goes all the way to Nevada. And all in between, you know, from top to bottom, the state there's tons of farming, agriculture, hunting fishing, like there's, there's much more rural space, then there is city. But we have a couple of like the hugest cities, you know, there's Los Angeles, San Francisco. San Diego's really big, right. But other than that, I mean, there's some sizable smaller, smaller cities and towns and stuff, but there's much more much more rural area than people think of and like that my album cover is this really beautiful spot out this near this ranch in Hollister, California. That's just some of the most beautiful country that you'll ever see. But that being said that really. Yeah, the landscape. It's really wild in a lot of places. is in pretty untouched if you go far out and that always was really inspiring to me just to be able to kind of access that where I grew up we lived right behind this creek and right down from the river and I would always play in that as a kid that's kind of where you know son of the San Lorenzo came from and it's played a big part I mean other other than you know obviously like Bakersfield sound influence I love that stuff but yeah definitely growing up in California has made me who I am and who I think you know somewhat of the songwriter that I am
Thomas Mooney 1:00:43
obviously you know, you're you're down in Austin now but and obviously you're on the road so much but how much do you do get back to California and try and visit you still have I'm assuming a lot of family out there
Jesse Daniel 1:00:58
Yeah, yeah all my family's basically in the Santa Cruz area they you know, I haven't I we moved out here about a little over six months ago and haven't been back there yet. As you know, we planned we're supposed to be in Santa Cruz. I think last weekend playing you know, we had a whole that whole month solid West Coast tour. And we're gonna try to see some family and everything so it's been kind of turned upside down with what's going on. But I definitely it's been it's been really cool. I love texas a lot and that's when we cut the record with Tommy I kind of really fell in love with this area. And the people and everybody that we met and definitely knew is the right move for us. But I'd be I'd be lying if I said I don't get homesick sometimes. You know, I definitely love my family and California in general. So definitely want to get back there soon as I can to see everybody.
Thomas Mooney 1:02:09
Yeah, for sure. Yeah, once a if we ever get out of quarantine 2020.
Jesse Daniel 1:02:18
But there'll be listening in like 200 years to this archived. Somehow they found this podcast like all this Alright,
Thomas Mooney 1:02:29
thanks for listening to once again, be sure to check out rolling on by Jesse Daniel. Check out episode sponsors Smith iron and design and liquors whiskey smoked jalapeno jelly. Okay, we will see y'all next week.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai