100: Clint Black
On Episode 100, I am joined by Country music legend Clint Black. During this hour-plus conversation, Black gives incredible insight, detail, and perspective on his storied career. We go back and talk about his breakthrough debut album Killin' Time (which last year was its' 30th year anniversary), how being in the public eye changed his songwriting, how he and guitarist Hayden Nicholas formed an as unbeatable songwriting & creative team, writing & collaborating with the likes of Merle Haggard, how "going electric" helped shape and expand his artistic process, and his latest album, Out of Sane.
This episode's presenting partner is The Blue Light Live and Wicker's Mesquite Smoked Jalapeno Jelly.
Interview Transcript
Note: Transcripts aren’t always accurate since they are computer automated and haven’t been edited for spelling, grammar, etc.
Thomas Mooney 0:01
Everyone, welcome to Episode 100 of new slang. I'm your host music journalist Thomas Mooney. And yeah, we have finally arrived at Episode 100. And as you can tell, it's with country music legend Clint black. I knew I wanted to do something special for this episode. And I had a short list of ideas, and some names of artists who I thought would maybe be ever so slightly more difficult to get on new slang. And if you followed me or this podcast, for even the tiniest bit of time, you'll know how much I am infatuated with 90s country music, something that I've dubbed the neon Eon. One day I'll write a book called that or something. So please, please don't try and steal that. So Clint Black has long been one of my favorite artists. I remember hearing his songs like killing time, no time to kill, like the rain, a better man summers come in, and so on. So often, while growing up. But really, it's been recently where I've come to really fully appreciate Clint as a songwriter, and a guitarist, and as a artist in general. And so as you'd expect, it was a slightly surreal experience talking with Clint for an hour about writing and recording all those songs, I really didn't know what to expect going in. I didn't know if you'd be really interested in talking about all those songs from 1989. And what it was like during the 90s, in country music, what it was like riding with people like Merle Haggard, but as you'll hear, Clint was just a joy to talk with. And obviously, more importantly, he was just incredible to just listen to, you know, it's one thing to have a lot of insight that's kind of expected for, for someone to have insight and recollections about songs that you're a part of. But what I was kind of blown away with was how introspective and in tune Clint was about his experiences in country music. I think what was really interesting to hear him talk about was about fame and those effects on him. You'd kind of expect the the general and broad way of how fame can affect someone you know, it affects your time and family life. But what he also mentions is how it affected how he came up with songs, before killing time, he could blend in and kind of be that wallflower to observe, but after you become a focal
point
and a public figure, it's so much harder to blend in with a kind of MIT was how he had to be a little bit more disciplined in songwriting, and realizing where a lot of those songs came from. I'm not sure if most people really think about how fame and becoming a public figure can have an effect on the creative process. There's just a wealth of knowledge in this episode, so I won't take much more of your time in this intro, but this is your first time listening to new slang, I'd highly appreciate you hitting that subscribe button at wherever you are listening. I release episodes twice a week, with a diverse blend of rising up and comers and established songwriters. At any rate, they're artists who I believe need to be heard. Before we get right into the interview. I wanted to talk to you a second about podcasting and buzzsprout it feels like everyone has a podcast these days. It's been really great to see people use podcasting as a storytelling outlet and to find like minded people, you may have seen new slang take a really big jump this past year and one of the main reasons has undoubtably been transitioning over to buzzsprout as my podcast host, they've really made all the quote unquote unfun things about podcasting so easy for starters. That's why new slang is on every major podcasting platform now and why it's been so uniform and organized online. I've always enjoyed speaking with songwriters and bands and artists, that's a given but now buzzsprout has made it so much easier on the publishing side. So if you've ever been interested in launching your own podcast, I'd highly recommend buzzsprout which if you follow the link in the show notes you'll be able to a sign up with buzzsprout be be given a $20 amazon gift card and see help support new slang. Again that link will be in the show notes. Alright, enough of the housekeeping notes here is Clint black. Where I guess I want to start off with is one of my favorite records is obviously like your debut record killin time. It came out just over 30 years ago, 30 years ago was last year the 30th anniversary. Now obviously like those songs, those songs are 30 years 30 plus years old. You probably don't think about it in in the as the as those years go by, but when you hit a milestone like that What did you What did you do? Did you kind of like have a little bit of a, a reflection moment, just to kind of appreciate and go, wow.
Clint Black 5:09
Yeah, the wow factor is there. And, and my manager and I were talking about what do we do we, you know, to commemorate and you know, he was he was talking about some events and, and things like that. And I remember, I remember just thinking, you know, I don't, I don't want to try to make too big a deal Adam and other than to, you know, celebrate, you know, the milestone of 30 years in this business making music and, and so for me, it became more of a evolved into more of not about that first album, but about the entirety of that 30 years, and, and what all I've done, and as I started thinking about that I never wanted to do a live album, I really felt like they detracted from what a live show experience was like, and so I was against it anytime anyone brought it up. But I always record my shows, too, with Pro Tools out there. So I'm recording, and, and I use those as, you know, work tapes if I need them. But never thought of them as, as, you know, anything to put out. And then hit me one day, you know, if I were ever going to release a live album, this would be the time. And if this goes by, what's another reason to release one? And so I started warming to the idea. And, and I had, you know, several approaches, one of which was, you know, what if I did, you know, all the songs off that album, and then I thought, you know, again, it really is about the 30 years, and not just looking back to that that moment. So, if I take songs, you know, that I've been doing on the road, then maybe the best thing is just to take a snapshot of who we are playing those songs is half the band was with me when I you know, it's making the demos and getting the record deal. So let's take a snapshot at this point in time, 30 years later, some of the songs from that first album, and some of the other songs from the 30 years. And, and then it really started to feel good and right. And, you know, I had my engineer pull some recordings and look for the ones that were the best technically, and we had a good night. And so we found an earmark some songs and said, All right, well, let's let's make it about these songs. And, and then symbol, you know, if I'm going to do a live album, I want it to really be live, you know, I'm not going to resync any of it. So we really have to find that Good night, you know, where all of the gear worked and, you know, no glitches. So we did that. And then and then there were only you know, a couple of there were two songs where the fiddle recording had been corrupted. And so I had my fiddle player, just come in and do one pass just like he would on the road. And and then we you know, replace those, those parts that were digitally corrupted. And so it was a live live live album, and real and authentic and all of that and I felt good about it. But I had these two songs that one I'd written before I met Hayden my lead guitarist and though I wrote you know, half of my hits with and and one other song that he and I wrote that would have gone on killing time where it not for walking away which is a waltz three core. And, and so and so this old house was to record her signature. So I didn't want to have two of those on the same album. So walking away beat out this old house in this old house got pushed aside and it got pushed aside again and again until it was forgotten. And I was looking back through everything over my career and all of the songs and and I found these two songs. And I, my manager I said Would it be weird to have two studio tracks on this and he loved the idea. We all chewed on it for a while and decided that would be good. There are songs from that era. They could have easily been on killing time. But for Other songs that went on instead. So let's do it. And, and that really was, I think the entirety of what we did to commemorate this, this milestone.
Thomas Mooney 10:15
Yeah, yeah, it's a, it's always interesting to, I feel like as a fan or as a journalist, you know, we get the finished product, but like, it's, that's just like the tip of that iceberg of what was going on, for that moment in time for for the artists, you know, and so like those other songs, the songs that ended up on the cutting floor or weren't recorded, or, you know, even just stuff that's was halfway finished, that adds so much context to that moment in your life. And I always love when artists will, will do that, go and revisit and, and show those other little moments that that could have, you know, taken place in an alternative history.
Clint Black 11:01
Yeah, I've listened to those, those Beatles tracks where they, they're talking about, either back then, or they're reflecting on that moment, and I love hearing that. It's, uh, you know, it's something I would probably do if, I mean, if this lockdown dragged on for much longer, I might get around to doing stuff like that. You know, sometimes I feel like I just don't even remember what in the world, we were thinking when we wrote that song. So what am I gonna say, and you know, but it's, you know, for, for me, looking back, the things that I'm going to reflect on. And remember, if you say 1989, first thing that's going to come to mind, for me is the craziest time of my life, trying to adjust to jumping onto a train doing 90. And when maintaining, you know, my sense of self and well being, and, you know, everywhere I went was an event, or a surrounding me and, and there were very few times in my life back then, where it wasn't some kind of an event. They're just, if I had if I had a day or a week off, which was rare, I wasn't going anywhere doing anything, you know, nothing but the couch. And, and so most of my life was consumed with trying to balance who I how I think of myself, and now everyone's seeing and treating me. And, and so I look back over those years. And I and I know it was harried and crazy. And I like to think I handled it well. But as I go from 89 to 95, I look back on 89 from 95. And I go, Yeah, I was handling that, well, it was crazy. And then, but now I'm handling it really well. And then when I look back on 95, from like 2000. And I'm going yeah, I was still wasn't handling it that well, still crazy in 1995. And then and then so now and 2020 looking back on, on all those years, I know just just how crazy it was at times and how displaced, you know, you can feel were, this is what I dreamed of. And it's what I'm wanting to do, and what I'm gonna do and what I want to still do. But there's still a mourning for the loss of something that you used to have, whether you whether you want what you have now or not. And I remember one time. I remember I remember going back to my old neighborhood, one of my trips back home, Houston, and driving just by coincidence past a bar I used to play and as a soloist me and my guitar and no band. And I remember driving past that bar and going, oh, here's that there's a little dump and dive in the strip center, you know. And nobody in there cared that I was playing. And and I remember the feeling it struck me like realizing at that moment that I've crossed a line, that I'll never be able to go into that bar again and be the same person I was when nobody cared that I was playing. And there's a sense of accomplishment and a sense of loss all at once. And I know it's hard for anyone who's dreaming of making it in this business to probably understand how they're connected. any remorse, you know, that goes along with your success. But it is like a death. You know, I have always been the guy playing in the bar who's watching people and what they do and seeing what their behavior and looking for an idea for a song and all that stuff that was gone. And I knew it instinctively. Crossing, I go and pass that bar. I knew this is this is I'm in a new life now. And that life lever be the same.
Thomas Mooney 15:34
Yeah, it's very, you're absolutely right. Like, it's one of those things where, you know, in a in a flash, you can't just go out to a hangout with a buddy at a bar anymore. You know, it's, it's
Clint Black 15:48
where you can but but you're carrying you're carrying new weights? Yeah. You have, you have new responsibilities. It's not just you anymore. It's, it's you and everyone's feelings, you're going to affect if you if you don't treat them just right. And when you're in a bar, especially somebody who's been drinking all night, their definition of treating them right. And mine might be a little different.
Thomas Mooney 16:16
Yeah, yeah, it's, you know, I've heard some people, like some fans say, you know, that an artist is all their job is quote, unquote, you know, that 90 minutes on stage or whatever. And I'm like, No, that's, that's absolutely not the case. Because if you run into Clint black at the grocery store, you have to be Clint black, in that moment, to you, it's not just a, the onstage or the show night or whatever, you're, you're that person. For forever. From that point on it, you you have to have the, your quote unquote, Clint black, the artist,
Clint Black 16:54
yeah, and there's no training for it. And there's a responsibility, you know, if you care how people feel, and I mean, if I weren't, anyone famous, I would still feel the same way. I don't like to hurt people's feelings. And, and, and if someone has loved my music, and, and then and suddenly, they're meeting me for the first time. You know, I remember when I met Clint Eastwood for the first time, you know, how he treated me would have mattered a lot, you know, if I would have caught him in the middle of walking from one thing to another, and, you know, then you look at it differently than, you know how people you like, treat you, you know, you you have a responsibility to their feelings. You know, it's, it's, it's sort of a weird thing, but I think if you're someone who likes people in general, you'd never want to hurt their feelings anyway. And, and lots of people, I've met her very, very reasonable, they understand that you can't stop and talk to him for 20 minutes, maybe you have somewhere to be and you know, and they appreciate, you know, over time, you know, thanks for stopping, you know, and saying hi, and let me telling you something, you know, and then there are other people who, who, you know, and it's rare, who will not be satisfied with just a moment of your time they they will resent anything less than everything they want out of that moment. And, and those are that's when you really feel it's, it's kind of crushing sometimes and then it's my feelings because I feel like there really isn't enough I can do for you to make you feel good. And so now I feel bad. I've had I've had fans say or do something that made it feel like they weren't looking at me as a human anymore and or someone who were they respected that I had to go from A to B and and you know, I'm on my way to a doctor's appointment, you know, quick Hello is great, but I gotta go you know, and, and they don't respect that and so then, you know, you you really have to try extra hard to, to make sure you don't make somebody feel bad or dissatisfied with the moment because then it starts to flow back on you. Now I feel bad. And it's, it's a, you know, James Taylor, big James Taylor fan and he has a lyric of fortune and fame. Such a curious game. Perfect. Strangers will call you by name. pay good money to hear fire and rain again and again and again. And You know, it's summer like summer coming back every year, got your baby got your blanket got your bucket of beer, I break into a grin from ear to ear. And suddenly, it's perfectly clear. That's why I'm here. And I always set out to be an entertainer, making music people love and treat people nicely. But I never, you know, I wasn't like Garth, I won't go 29 hours without peeing. So that you know, I can, I will go into the bathroom, when my bladder is about to explode, I need you to know that. I will go to the bathroom, when I really have to go and assume that you're going to know, I still care. You know. So certain people appreciate that. And some people don't. And, you know, I asked George Strait once when I was just getting going. I said, How do you do it? How do you you're going in and you're planning for 1000s of people and you have to head out the door to the airport, and there's a bunch of people out back and you can't stop? How do you go past them? And forget exactly what he said, but he had a great answer. You know, it was basically you just have to do what you can for people when you when you have time and you know, let it go?
Thomas Mooney 21:28
Yeah.
It was, it's really interesting that you said something you said a minute ago about how it affected your it can affect where you kind of get songs from so many of your songs, you know, you have that what I would call, kind of like you've taking and put a spotlight on like the wallflower. Like, I feel like a lot of the songs feel like you're very insightful to the people on the outside their feelings, right? And, you know, so much of that is you can get from is from people watching. And when when you go from being the someone who's able to watch to being where that spotlight is on you. That I think that's an it's incredibly insightful. Did you did you feel you had to like, it changed the way you you wrote songs, or did you just have to be
a little bit more,
I guess, careful, we're like, more attentive to where those, those moments came where you're able to people watch or we get
Clint Black 22:38
I sort of, you know, I continue to be a student of human behavior. I still had lots of people around me and lots to witness. But I also would read books, you know, read books, watch movies, documentaries, I would read psychology books, you know, when psychologists would put out a book that would become a best seller, and suddenly everybody knows about it, I read that book, you know, Seven Habits of Highly Effective People or something like that, you know, I read that book, and there was a line in there, where the author was suggesting that our relationships would be a lot better off if we treated love as a verb instead of a noun. So that went into my brain. And, you know, five years later out came, love isn't something that we have, it's something that we do it that the observation kept going, it just, you know, I was just in a different world. Looking out at it.
Thomas Mooney 23:46
Yeah, that's, that's one of those songs where I guess like when you, you know, growing up, I guess, you know, I've heard it a million times, but then that one day where it really clicked it, you know, it clicked and you're like, Oh, yeah, this is this is exactly what he's talking about now. And it's not just the, you know, I guess
Clint Black 24:06
it was that way. You know, I think Desperado and the bars for years, and then I recorded it on the common thread album, Eagles tribute. And then I was out performing it on the road, you know, for, you know, crowds of 1000s of people. And one night I'm up there singing it and I was like, Ah, there's this new moment in my life where a lyric in that song that had always meant something to me suddenly means something else also, because the context and the life I'm living now, and and even songs of my own I'll be singing on stage and trying to feel and and something will pop into my head and it'll be a new thought a new look at my own thought. It's a funny thing. Yeah,
Unknown Speaker 25:00
it's it's,
Thomas Mooney 25:01
it is interesting to see how how time, you know, obviously attaches itself to songs, but then also kind of can help morph and change them. And, you know, depending on the day you listen to them, you're going to catch something. And it what I find incredibly interesting is when when it does that with a songwriter to is when they, you know, they wrote it about this moment in their life, but then now they have a different feel to it. And they can still, like feel that same, that initial feeling, but then also like, Oh, yeah, this was what? Also this means to her, you know?
Clint Black 25:37
Yeah, yeah. Because we we evolved. And, you know, the thing that popped into my head when you're saying that is, you know, I think it was a Russian who said it if you, if you don't love it, if you're 20, and you don't love Russia or whatever, you know, you're you have no heart if you're 40. And you do you have no brain, it was one of those things where it might have been about socialism or something, you know, because we're young, we're idealistic. We, we see the way that everything can be, we, we know, we have it figured out, and then you find out 20 years later, well, I didn't have it all figured out. And, and, you know, there's, it's just, it's called maturing, you know, where, where I look, now, as a father of my own father differently, I understand things that he did more clearly now than ever, even though at the time I knew what he was doing and why he was doing it, why he was punishing me or whatever, why, you know, he would or wouldn't let me have the car keys, you know, whatever it was. But But until you've lived a little more, you know, you you can't, you can only see part of it, I told my daughter, when she was a lot younger, she's 19. But when I told her when she was much younger, I was trying to teach her something. I said, You know, I said, You're like, you're like if an alien was dropped onto this planet, nine years ago, so she was nine. So you're like, if an alien was dropped on this planet, nine years ago, and you're trying to understand how everything works, learn the language, learn what to watch out for. And all of that. And, and I was dropped here 58 years ago, you know, or 50 years ago, whatever it was, I know my way around, you know, I don't have all the answers, but I know my way around. And I you know, I when I was dropped on here, it had been firing on all pistons for 100,000 years of civilization, whatever it is, and, and I said, so it's really important for you to stick close to and learn from somebody who was dropped onto the planet 50 years ago, because I've seen a few things and I can warn you about them and show you some ways to have a lot of fun, etc, etc. And so, you know, that's, that's kind of how you come to this evolution of you know, I don't see my song in the same way anymore. It's, I mean, I have songs that I've written where I just don't even agree with what I said. I don't like what I said necessarily, or it's just doesn't say it quite as well.
Thomas Mooney 29:02
This episode is sponsored by the blue light live my all time favorite music venue in bar. As you know, the covid 19 pandemic has been difficult on small businesses, music venues, bars and musicians. There are a handful of ways that you can help though. For starters, go over to www dot blue light lubbock.com. Click on the merge tab at the top of the page and order yourself a blue light hat t shirt in koozie Second, if you haven't purchased Monday night lights, a 50 song compilation of Lubbock songwriters organized by songwriter and photographer extraordinary Charlie stout and myself, head over to www dot Monday night lights.com. The proceeds of this 50 song collection go directly to the bartending staff. We launched it a few months back and we were blown away by the response and reception. And of course if you're just hearing about it now go ahead and get it today. This collection will never be on iTunes or on Apple Music. So the only spot you'll be able to get an ad is at Monday night lights.com. Although both links into the show notes for easy access, all right, back to the show. Like, obviously, like you've written, basically all everything that you've recorded. And I guess like I think for for, you know, for country music or just music in general. You learn that there are songwriters out there who, who write songs, and there's really great artists who can translate that for the public and cover those songs really well. Obviously, you know, here in country music, you know, there is a lot of really great song interpreters. But you know, when you when you dive into the the liner notes, the one thing you notice with Clint black is that he's written, like, 99% of the songs he's recorded. Was that that wasn't ever was that ever anything that you were that you'd miss? Or that you that was something that you want it to be a staple of your your career is that? You were?
Clint Black 31:16
Yeah, a songwriter, as well. Yeah, there's only one song that I recorded that I didn't write. If you don't, if you don't cap cover songs like Desperado, the wasteland song or money, Python, galaxy song, everything else I've written. One song I recorded around 2007 called the strong one I didn't write and the record company, my company asked, you know, let's do an experiment. And let's just meet with the publishers and have them all pitch you a song and see if there's one song we can find that you would you would record as an outlier, you know, and so I did it. But when, when I was growing up, I read the liner notes. My dad showed me, Look, here's where the artists name is us, the, the writer of the song and here's the producer, usually Billy Cheryl, if it's good. And so that's, you know, my dad educating me. And from that point on, I read liner notes. And then I noticed the sorry, hang on one second. Try to get this noise away.
So I'm reading the liner notes. And I'm noticing the lot of the artists I listen to wrote their own songs. James Taylor, Jimmy Buffett, Loggins and Messina, Merle Haggard, Willie Nelson, Waylon Jennings Waylon recorded a lot of outside songs and sort of Willy and but the Eagles, you know, and on and on and on, and I and I started to realize that I gravitated more toward them. And, and that's what I wanted to be. And, and then I remember before I got my record deal, I was watching or listening to an interview with Reba. And she was saying, well, I listened to probably 1000 songs to pick 10 for an album. And I thought, whoa, that sounds really hard. Man, I don't know if I, I want to, I want to try to keep myself out of that position. That's, it's, if I can ride them. And so when I got my record deal, I told Hayden, Nicholas stuff said, I said, if, if I get my way, I'm going to get real busy really soon. So we need to start writing for the second and third album now. So as a result of that, every time I went in to make another album, I always had about 30 songs written. And that's how songs like this old house and no one here for me get pushed aside because new stuffs constantly coming in. And, and so I never had a shortage of songs. But when I got to, around my fourth album, after the hard way, the record company started pressuring me to record outside songs. And, you know, my attitude was, Well, wait a minute, you know, I think I did a pretty good job on the other ones, and, you know, I didn't understand and so I didn't, and I recorded that no time to kill album and we had five hits off of that. And then I recorded the one emotion album and we had five hits off of that. And then I run into cut two songs to have as additions to my first greatest hits album. And like, the rain was Have them and the head of the label didn't like my second verse. And I went to talk to Stroud, my co producer, and I said, What do you think I should do? He said, You know what, he's the head of your record company. And it's so easy for you to write a verse just write another second verse. So I did and I recorded that and send it along and word came back that he loved it had my label so so I went in to talk to him. And I said, Listen, I hope you know that I want to be you know, the strongest adhesive in this relationship and I like the spirit of cooperation. And that's why I you know, wrote a new second verse you know, I said, but I need to understand why it's so important the pressure to record outside songs had grew grown more and more and more even with the hits bag goodbye good brought bad luck state of mind, oh, time to kill, you know, summers come in all of that, you know, I was having a lot of hits. And even in the face of that the pressure for me to record songs written by Nashville, you know, songwriters, etc, was growing, the pressure was becoming pretty intense. And, and I said, I just need to understand why it's so important. And he said, they just want a little taste. Martin, my heart sank. At that tell me my songs really aren't that good, even though they're selling something. But that this is about sharing revenue with publishing companies and writers in this town. And that's your reason to come after my life's work. Not good enough. Not good enough. So I did, I went on and I recorded that nothing but the taillights album and wrote everything on it. And the electrified I did for cover songs and wrote everything else on it. And when I said I do then there, you know, had had hits all along the way. And then whenever I, whenever I left RCA, I met with a couple of major record companies. And they wanted to sign me really happy to but not if I insist on writing my own songs.
And so I did an independent record. And then some major labels wanted to sign me after that. And so I met with three different labels over about a three year period, each one going through like a courtship and, and each time they wanted me and everything about me. And by the end of it, they said, but you know, if you just wouldn't insist on writing your own songs, and I thought, Man, this is just your company, buddy, you can do with your company what you want. But no, I'm not signing up for for any of this. So So here I am. Today, I'm an indie artists, I put out my own records on my own label, I have a distribution deal with a subsidiary of one of the major labels, I don't have any kind of a promotion team out promoting my records at Radio, but I'm doing the best work of my life. And that's in the end, what I'll be most proud of where the the record sales and awards are, are exciting. And they bring a lot of revenue to the, to the artists. If I had, if I had impacted my life's work for the sake of that, I would not be happy. I would not be happy today. And so, so I really had to it was a great point of contention. But when, when is really after my first album, they tried to get me to record some outside songs. And I said, I've got plenty, and I didn't hear anything else about it. But I thought, you know, the guy who wrote that killing time album, probably Yeah, to let him keep his job. It's kind of the way I looked at it.
Thomas Mooney 39:21
Yeah. Well, you know, is what it sounds like. is at that point, it's it's not about it's the commercial lusatian of art right? It's not about the the actual armor. Yeah, and it just that's the I don't it just sounds like you know, that's where you're you're at a loss, you know, like those people have lost the, the forest for the trees you know, and you know, I always kind of look back at when talking with with, you know, friends who are young songwriters and is like you know, in in after f This is all done, people are going to look at your work and realize, you know, like, Oh, you know, this is they're able to take it all at once and, and realize that there is the, I guess I have like one buddy who has had a line about his name's john Bauman and it's too late to quit or too soon for accolades and too late to quit, and just kind of about, you know, it's, at some point, you'll get your accolades, you're at some point, people will praise You for the stuff you've done, you know, even if it's, even if you think it's too late at the time, you know, so, you know, I
Clint Black 40:39
appreciate that one, but I won't say his name. I don't, you know, hadn't gotten his blessing to do so. But someone my brother knows who's one of the all time great songwriters, when I greatly respect, said, Hey, I just decided one day that I was gonna go through your brother's entire catalogue, and just see what kind of songwriting he has done. And his assessment was very flattering. And that meant more to me than any award. You know, I, I really feel like it's the work that I enjoy. And the rewards wouldn't be nearly enough, if I didn't enjoy the work. And it's too hard to make a record, it's 1012 hours a day. And it gets inside you like a year warm and, and it takes over your life. And, you know, I think about you know, Jackson Pollock, you know, you're you get to a point where you're so consumed by it, I can't even stand in the kitchen and, and have a conversation because the music won't stop in my head. And Lisa knows, you know, after all these years, she'll go, you didn't hear any of that, did you and I go, No. Go back to work or whatever. Reminds me of a funny line where the wife says, You're not listening to a word, I'm saying, Are you and I thought to myself, What a weird way to start a conversation. You know, it's a lot of work, and to dedicate that work to somebody else's work. I don't think I can't do that couldn't do it. I've been offered jobs, you know, and television and movies. And then I look at it, I say, you know, I can't do that 10 hours a day. I can't, you know, would pay well, would put me in a good light. But I couldn't do that. I couldn't do that 10 hours a day. Yeah, you know, I'm still putting in hours and hours, I put in hours every day practicing on my guitar. You know, I'll watch, you know, guitar lessons on YouTube and try to get my brain to see things that can't see. You know, I'm still very, very active, very driven. I learned how to engineer just about anything I want to engineer except I still hire an engineer for tracking sessions and mixing. You know, but I can run my entire studio, maybe and usually will and, and, and I can do it 1012 hours a day. And you know, I cannot imagine. I can't imagine just saying well, you know, you can do half your job, but you can't do your whole job.
Thomas Mooney 43:47
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. You know, you've mentioned Hayden, a few times your guitar player, you guys have obviously written a bunch of the songs together collaborated over the years, just in general, I guess, like, how is that partnership adapted and morphed over these 30 plus years?
Clint Black 44:12
Well, we're like brothers, you know, we've lived together on the road for 30 years, we met 33 years ago. And it's like, it's like, the family history, you know, with my brothers, and we don't have to educate each other on our family history. We were there. Right. So when it comes to our life in this business and, and the body of work, there's, there's a shorthand There, there. Not much needs to be said. I mean, if we started writing a song that sounded like another song we'd already written, we wouldn't have to say it. Unless it was just like, you know, Oh, my, you know, and I caught it before he did or vice versa. So the other part of that is, is he's really, he's really my bandleader. You know, he, he makes sure that everybody's, you know, happy. And if there's anything that needs to be brought to my attention, you know, he will, or he'll tell him, you need to go talk to Clint and, you know, if, if anything, you know, if I'm seeing something that I think is a problem in the band, you know, I go to Hayden and talk to him first and say, What am I What am I seeing? And why is that? Is it what I think it is, you know, is something wrong with him? Is there anything you know, you know, and, and so, it's just like, it's, you know, most of those guys have been with me for a long time, and including my crew. And so it's like a family. And, and Hayden and I have managed that together for all these years. So aside from even the writing, and the work, and, you know, the musical stuff, you know, just making sure we have a happy, healthy, you know, family out on the road. You know, that's, that's something that we've done together. And I rely on him greatly. For and, you know, including my own faults and flaws. You know, I need to be, I need to be careful about everybody's feelings are, what their needs are, if I'm telling them enough, or whatever. And, you know, we just manage that together all this time is so it's, it's a it's something that comes out of that that's, you know, you can't really say anything, it's like a brother, you know?
Thomas Mooney 46:50
Yeah. Yeah, I like the, you know, you say in the shorthand like it, that's Yeah, when you get to a point like that with somebody, you know, it's just, I don't know, there's, that's where the magic is, you know, and now, like, from like, I guess, like an outside perspective, I guess, like, we're, you know, you you read about Clint black, and you read about how you and Hayden me and he becomes your guitar player. And that's where really things just kind of click, did it feel like it clicked in the moment? Like, that was just a we're, we've, we're on to something now? Or was it? Did it feel like you were it was gonna be, you know, stuff? Did it feel? Did it feel any different in the moment, I guess, is what I'm asking.
Clint Black 47:34
In the moment. It was, it was clear to me instantly, wow, that guy on guitar, Good Lord, you know, he's amazing. And I'm gonna, you know, talk to him more, because I just hired this band, to back me on one gig I needed to do in order to get a bunch of solo gigs out of this country club. No solo gigs, were gonna pay really well. But I wasn't going to get those unless I played this banquet for this guy, booking them. And he wanted me to have a band. So I found a band he was filling in for the guitar player that had just quit the band. And so I knew instantly, I want to talk to that guy more, you know. And so he and I gravitated toward each other. And what are you doing? What are you doing? I was trying to make demos without money. And he had an eight track recorder in his garage. So we struck a deal to record those demos. And, and, yeah, it was, it was just instantly clear. This is this is how I'm going to find a manager with these demos. And then when he said, Oh, I write to, and he played me a musical thing. And I had just written a lyric the night before I had no music for. And I said play it again. And he played it again. And when he did I sang straight from the factory. We were made for each other one of those things, it's meant to be straight from the factory, nothing less than exactly, you're the only lock just made to fit my key. And it was they fit. They just fit perfectly, like a lock and a key. And we both were looking at each other going. Let's write that. So we wrote that. And then we started scheduling time to write and work on demos. And we first song that we finished demoing was nobody's home. I found a manager. I knew he was a big time manager and that I was about to get a break. And so we started writing more we wrote better man, and killing time came later. Right? Right before we learned to cut I think the last tracks on that album. But we'd written walking away and and some of the other songs on there and some would come later. And yeah, it was it was clear. This is really, really work. King? And yeah, I really, I just I really believe we're doing something here that people are gonna like. Yeah, and yeah,
Thomas Mooney 50:14
yeah, well, it just, it felt like you guys pulled so much out of each other, like the the tone of the guitars just really played well with the way your vocals and vice versa. And then you guys just were able to really echo what the words were saying in a song and I don't know, I just felt like there's just a magic was created. And those moments.
Clint Black 50:42
Yeah, and you know, Hayden, you know, never ran out of ideas. You know, I always had a real clear sense of what I liked and didn't like, and you know, so I, I really learned the art of recording a demo with eight tracks, you know, and making the most of that I learned that from Hayden. And then I started to learn, you know, from James Stroud, and, you know, and then, you know, is, is as we started making the record, you know, I didn't always know the right language at the time, but I knew what I was liking and what I wasn't liking. Hayden had a library of things that he knew that guitar players had done for the last 50 years. And, and, you know, so if I was saying, you know, that's not working, you know, I really want something that's a little more swingy. Or, I mean, I may use some some, you know, line like that, you know, and he would, he would come up with some way to translate that into something he could do. It was his idea to use the, the Jerry Jones, six string bass for killing time, he came up with that, and that was just, wow, that really adds a lot. Yeah. And then he, you know, years later would say to me, you know, with your style of finger picking on acoustic you really could play electric guitar and do some of this type of stuff. And he did some Blick and I said that I laughed, and I said, No, I couldn't, there's no way and he goes, Yeah, you could, you know, look, here, just do this one step at a time. And he, he taught me some licks to practice on and that really launched me into all of the guitar stuff I did on no time to kill, he played almost all the electric guitars on that album. And, and that was really Hayden, you know, one day when we were songwriting, and took a break for a minute to let our brains rest. And, and he pushed me into that and said, you know, you could do this, you know, you you've got a style on acoustic that would translate, you know, onto the electric went really well. And then, all these years later, I'm playing stuff on electric guitar that I wouldn't have thought, you know, I never set out to do it. I was just was singing you know, trying to play well enough to accompany myself on acoustic.
Thomas Mooney 53:24
Yeah, yeah. Opening the, the other creative outlets, I guess. Right. You know, one of the things also, like, I've always, I guess, noticed in your career is the, you're writing all the songs you're writing a lot with Hayden, but then also, you know, you have a lot of other collaborations with, you know, like Steve Warner, and you wrote a few songs with Merle Haggard. What were in those moments, like when you were riding with, you know, people that were not with you from the, from the beginning, or, you know, what did you learn from someone like Merle Haggard?
Clint Black 54:07
Well, I, most of what I learned from maril I learned from playing and singing his songs and listening to him all those years. But a funny thing, you know, it's like, you know, if you if you ever meet Steve Martin, you'll recognize instantly why he's so popular. is like you meet him and you go, God, I get it. You know, he's just he Steve Martin, you know, and there are people like that and Merle is one of them. And, and that is when we were writing untangle in my mind. He really had about he was about half written. There was some, some gaps in there and all but He wrote down what he had and made me a board tape of what he had and gave it to me. And then I worked on it for about three days, and wrote down the lyrics, as I had them now and sent it back to him through his tour manager. And the band. My band and I are sitting in the dressing room, Merle and I are on tour together and and Merle comes in, you know, Hey, are you doing? And he puts the lyric sheet down on the coffee table in front of me. And I said, What do you think? And he said, Well, he said, if he said, just because of one word, I'd have to give it an A minus the professor's grade of my paper. So I instantly said what I knew was I knew what it was because it bothered me too. But I didn't have anything else. And and I said, Well, what would you said, and he kind of I think it felt like it caught him a little off guard. But he went, he said, well be leaving. It was so obvious, you know, it was so obvious, though, it was just like, you know, you learn that's, that's because he's Merle Haggard, that he was able to do that, you know, and, also that, you know, I felt like the song from what he and I had written except for that one little spot was really good. And that he thought so too, you know, was another one of those, you know, those sort of verifications, you know, he's Merle Haggard, you know, and I think I know, what's good enough for Moreau because I know, his work inside and out. And I wouldn't have given him that sheet of paper, if I didn't think it was good enough. And, and he verified that for me, and it just sort of becomes this, you know, sort of the professor and the student moment that I'll never forget. You know, just as a reason, he's Merle Haggard. You know, there's a reason we love Steve Martin. You know, if you stood around and talk to haggard for five minutes, you know, it would be one of the best five minutes of your life. Same with bucho. And, you know, they're just people out there like that where you go, Yeah, yep. Sure. What a thought.
Thomas Mooney 57:48
Yeah, the, yeah, it has to be like that moment of like, I don't like the Yeah, you said, you know, validates, you know, and a lot of ways right in it. It has to be also incredibly humbling to realize, you know, like that, you know, he's a validated your, your quote, unquote, your work, right. You're, you're got the stamp of approval, and, but also at the same time, like, you know, well, that means I got to keep on working at this level. You know, I it's, it has to be kind of an amazing feeling.
Clint Black 58:23
Yeah, I always I always felt like, I don't want my work to be judged just by the fans. I don't want it to meet their, their standards. I want my musical heroes, if they look over at a TIFF say, that's good work. You know, if Don Henley heard one of my songs, you know, I would I would want to to meet his standards. Or James Taylor or, you know, Willie So, so I'm getting a chance to work with someone who, who has meant so much to me. And, and do some work that they felt was, you know, even almost complete. It was very, very, very satisfying.
Thomas Mooney 59:21
Yeah, now, obviously, you know, you've mentioned a whole lot of your heroes on the country side. Obviously, you mentioned Jimmy Buffett and people like that as well. And you did do some collaborations with people like Bruce Hornsby like I guess like that's like a People often think of like those kind of guys like him and Kenny Loggins or Michael McDonald, like those as being a in a different world.
Clint Black 59:47
Your Wiener? Yeah,
Thomas Mooney 59:49
yeah.
What uh, I guess like what it doesn't feel like you've ever you were ever afraid to, you know, collaborate with those kind of guys who may be Outside the the quote unquote country realm
Clint Black 1:00:05
No, because I love their music. And I also see the common threads. Pardon the pun. And I also know that that there are a lot of people outside of country music who love country music. I mean, a lot of these rock artists love country music. And so it's just like, you know, comedians, just because you're Jeff Foxworthy. You know, you may love Monty Python. Even though you know, you you have this redneck chick. You know, you could love Monty Python. I love Jeff Foxworthy billing ball. Larry, the Cable Guy. And I love you know, Eric Idle and Michael Pailin those guys. And so the one thing that, that I think we all like to do, you know, like Darryl strawberry, you know, I got to go play some baseball, you know, well, you're a football player. Yeah, that's right. I love baseball. You know? I know. I mean, especially if you take guys like Kenny Loggins. And you know, you. You look at the old Loggins and Messina stuff, you know, there's stuff in there. That's, well, Anne Marie covered a couple of them had big country hits on a love song and Danny song. So the common threads are there, we're all, you know, part of the same fabric. And it really just depends on the individual a bit, you hit it off, did you want to stretch out, I want to stretch out and do something with a rock artists and the rock artist wants to stretch out and do something country, you know, the Eagles plenty of their stuff would be right into the 90s country mold. Yeah, so it's a real comfortable fit. And just then comes down to the individual. And there are people who are too weird to, you know, just have coffee with I just can't relate to this person, you know, I can't sound I've been around and work with people where I'm trying to have a conversation and I'm thinking, I don't think we're, you know, we're reading from a different book or a different language. And, you know, this is just, this is really, really difficult, which makes you want to do it more in a one way, you know, I got to figure out how to, you know, how to have this conversation. You know, but when you when you do make those connections there, where you both seem to be reading from the same sheet music, and on the same page. It's really exciting and real satisfying.
Thomas Mooney 1:03:12
Yeah.
You know, obviously, you have this new record coming out this June, at a sane you know, you you mentioned working on, I guess all the other aspects of being a songwriter or an artist, you know, the the engineering and the getting be a better guitar player and getting to be, you know, just all the studio aspects of that. What goes into that to
what, uh,
I guess, like, what, on this new record out here, what have you. I guess, like, found that you, you've loved to do most like as, as you've picked up all these little pieces, and these tools to help become a better more well rounded artist.
Clint Black 1:04:00
Well, I finding I'm having to resist the urge to put slotted guitar on songs now because I've picked up slide guitar on the previous album, on purpose, and played it on a record for the first time ever and, and I love that I really love it. It's exciting, new, new instrument kind of and, and so I really enjoyed that I really, I really enjoy the process. When it gets toward the end of, of, you know, there's what I call doing mutes and that is going through and finding the spots where there's too much going on and something has to go. I really like getting to the point where we're really refining what the band is doing at any given moment at the end the song with We overplay and especially when we're overdubbing. The idea is to overplay and just have fun and just do everything you could possibly come up with within reason. You know, you don't want to create too much work for me later. But, you know, if it's me playing or somebody overdubbing fiddle or Dover or something, you know, give me everything you got for a few passes. And then let's, let's hone in on the things that are really special and make sure they're just right. And then I'll have all kinds of other stuff. And, and once I get to a point where, where I'm now really starting having to decide who in the band is going to be planted at every given moment, so that there's no arm wrestling that bothers the ear. That's exciting for me, because it's when the real sound and feel of the album starts to take shape. And I really am able to start seeing, you know, hearing what my album is going to sound like, because it's always, almost always an experiment and trying to get what's in my head on the tape. And it'll never be just what I was after. You know, there's happy surprises and there's things that never quite worked out. But this is good too. And so, you know, it's, that's a fun part, but I'd say I'd say number one would be
you know, playing the guitar.
Thomas Mooney 1:06:31
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Okay, back to the show.
Yeah, you know, this, this record right here, I've listened through a few times and, you know, you, I think what's such an important aspect of an artist is, when an artist still has something to say. And sometimes, you know, artists can lose that momentum or lose what they, I guess, like, they're that guiding light or something like that, or become out of touch with what they're originally we're trying to say. And it feels like you You still have that your finger on the pulse, you know, your your thumb on the pulse of what you're trying to say. And I don't know, I think that's just that's obviously a great thing for an artist, you know, to always be able to find that that pulse.
Clint Black 1:08:56
Yeah, thanks, I, I really, I really worry or worried in the early days about going into the well too many times and drawing it out, trying to write when I shouldn't be writing and I decided back then I'm going to truly do this in cycles. So I wouldn't come off of the road with a few days here and there or whatever, and just go right with somebody. I would I would go I would go in cycles because I felt like the least I decided that I'm going to go out and live and and get input and feed the tank. And then hope that the result is when I go back to the well there's something there. And and I think that you know a lot of that comes from being exposed to other art, other other writers other music. Some of it comes from you know, reading, you know, there's still a lot left to read out. There, and some of it is just, you know, taking good care of my brain, you know, you know, I have never had, you know, had an addictive personality, I don't, you know, drink a lot, I don't do any drugs and, you know, I try to stay, you know, good and healthy and feed my brain. And because I think that's critical. I think, you know, you've had to put stuff into your brain, and then your brain, every time you put something in there, every time you work on a problem, there's, there's physical wiring in the brain. And whenever you're trying to solve a problem, your brain is trying to wire itself to solve that problem for you. And if you'll give it the time, give it some input, it'll, it'll do the work. And, and so the, the other part of it is, you know, you really do need to know what all has already been said, and how it has been said, otherwise, it's going to be really hard to remain original. You know, I try not to ever write a line that's, you know, since we're through, you know, or you broke my heart. I mean, there's just certain things that we heard in the 50s, right. And then we heard it in the 60s. And, you know, it was, it was the number one hook in a song, it's okay, if it's some line, that's, it's, it's buried in there. But if your hook is something that you've heard already too many times, if the if the basis, the anchor for everything else in the song, is something that has already been said that way, at least a few times, you know, you're, you're just in trouble. So you have to be aware, you have to be paying attention. If you want to be original, it's the number one piece of advice I give to young artists know the music that has already come before you so that you don't rewrite it, you know, may try to make it your own when the rest of us who've already been around for a while, listen to it say well, you know, I really liked that when the Eagles did it.
Thomas Mooney 1:12:31
Right. Yeah. I've always, I'll get you out on this last question. It's, it's kind of one of those things I've always been interested in is the the physical aspect of writing. I guess, like how is like technology changed the way you write a song? I'm assuming, you know, back then you were doing a whole lot of like notebook and pen writing. Yeah, have you? Have you turned over to the the laptop or anything like that? Or is it Yeah, you still, like the actual like, no,
Clint Black 1:13:03
I still use, I still use some paper, but the laptop is open and the USB keyboard is attached. I will, I will type out lyrics on the screen. But I'll do something Hayden and I started years ago, you know, we do a bubble sheet. And it's a creative exercise, take your central idea, write it down, and then and then keep expanding and spiraling outward from everything that is related to it that you can think of. So that when you get, you know, the bottom to the bottom of the page, or two pages over, and you look at all the bubbles with words, and they all somehow no matter how remote, they are to the central idea, at that point, they all still relate back to that idea somehow. And then you have this, this sort of a roadmap to the thinking behind your idea. And the way your brain looked at it anyway, that you can always glance at it, it's always there for you, and you don't have to rethink that. And then and then it becomes a process of trying to construct the lyrics. And, and that's when you're, you know, just playing the chord progression over and over, work in the melody and hoping that words fly out of your mouth, you know, each time you go around. And to help with that I'll take a USB keyboard and, and pick out a drum pattern. And and create a loop so that it's almost like playing with a band. And, and just you know, get that tempo right and get that groove right and play along with it and hope that words fly out. And and then once the song is there and constructed it it'll it'll take It'll take days, and days for all of that to sort itself out and become satisfactory. I, I really carve on the melody, usually right up until the last minute, just to keep trying to carve every bit of originality out of it, I can. And so, you know, what was the basic melody at the top, even if it's just okay, but I know, there's, I'll know, that I know, what I'm going to do with this, is if I'm co writing, if I'm writing by myself, I don't, I don't even give it a second thought. But if I'm writing with someone else, you know, I'll say this is, you know, I'm gonna keep working on this, you know, and sort of establish an understanding that this is our placeholder. And it's only going to get better. So if we like it now, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's really good to go, but it's going to get better. And then the lyrics you know, I will do the same thing with those and all the days coming and continually just try to make sure there's no better way there's no more original way to say that and keep, keep carving on it. And there are exceptions every now and then, like America. Third song on this album, where the album was finished and being mastered. And Steve came over, show me his new guitar, Steve Warner Grinch. And, and I told him the idea I had, and he goes, Oh, we gotta write bad. And I said, Well, what would we do and musically, and he goes, Oh, man, he's had his guitar in his hand, he just started playing this thing. And I started singing. And next thing, you know, we're over in front of my laptop, and I'm typing stuff out, and we are ready. We aren't even halfway through finishing the song. But I know we're going to get there. And I know where it's going. And it has to be on this album. So while we're writing on texting musicians, checking on avails texting, texting, texting my production assistant, you know, find out a break, he's available, you know, and when and so, and the time it took for us to get to the song being pretty much complete and structure and a couple of gaps that will fill them. We had scheduled a session for four days later. And so we got in, got the song cut, I got my vocals down, got background singers in,
got my slide guitar part on there, gave it to Ricky to start mixing and, and jumped on the bus and hit the road to go play and Kansas and got to the first gig. And bam, the quarantine was there. The lockdown was there. We didn't have a show that night and got on the bus and turn around and came home. And and and so then it was just like, mix mix mix. If this thing finished my deadlines approaching, I got it in and got it mastered and added to the album on the day of the deadline. And, and if that had been delayed anymore, I wouldn't have made it onto the album. If it had been any slower on getting the recording session done, may not have been able to get the musicians in the room because of the quarantine.
Thomas Mooney 1:18:51
Right? Yeah, it's sometimes it's it's, it's just a it's all the I guess, like cutting in, in those margins. You know, it's sometimes Yeah, just how it
Clint Black 1:19:02
and that's and that's one of the and that's one of the few exceptions where I didn't chew and chew and chew on that still did chew on that song because I had a week to 10 days from you know, you know, from when we started writing it until I had to sing the vocal and commit the lyrics to there's actually one lyric that I when the background singers came over I had improved on and before they put their background part on Iran in there and resetting the lyric. So it was just a real exception to the amount of time beating up on the melody and the lyric and then the slide part. You know the hook lead. And, and I'm thinking I'm thinking man that's so simple as that. Is that really mine is that You know, original enough? It's too simple. But I don't hear anything else when I hear that, huh?
Thomas Mooney 1:20:11
Yeah, it's, that's, that's what so I guess when you you get so far into like, how you were saying just a minute ago about you know, your biggest advice to songwriters is to listen to what's come before you so you know, you know, it's it has to be that just as much that when you're when you've recorded a whole lot of music, am I not just like copying something else from someone else? But yeah, copying myself even you know, that's
Clint Black 1:20:43
Yeah, we're doing something.
Thomas Mooney 1:20:45
Yeah, I what I find probably the most interesting in like telling in all of that is, you know, it is you learn that having like a filler is okay. And that like, you know, you'll you'll be able to work on that over time and not necessarily.
Clint Black 1:21:06
How old are you, man?
Thomas Mooney 1:21:07
Yeah, like some kind of placeholder. Because like, even as a writing journalist, I've had, like, I've come to the point where it's like, you know, don't erase anything, just just have it on the margins if you need it, or if you up above or whatever, and you can always go back and change the Edit. And I feel like, that's what I guess like, you, you get it in your head that like, you know, all these great artists, they just, they do this in 10 minutes. And it's, that's obviously not the case, you know, it's very, very few and far between where things come together so quickly, it's, you know, it's a lot of work to, to get that final product. So it's, I don't know, I think it's very telling. So, it's very reassuring for I think, for a lot of people too. So
Clint Black 1:22:02
yeah, you know, you know, if someone is making something look easy, don't let them fool you. That may look easy, and it may be even be easy, but the work it took to make it easy for them. You know, we all have to do the work. And, you know, especially young kids today, you know, I always said, You know, I wish I could just just grab a bus full of, you know, inner inner city kids or kids, you know, growing up in poverty, you know, and drive around some of the, the more affluent neighborhoods, and show them and point to these houses in these restaurants, nice restaurants in the neighborhood and all these businesses that are so well adorned, and with stone brick entrances, and all of that stuff, you know, where they may come from an area where everything just looks like crap, and it's run down. And it's, it gives you a feeling of hopelessness, you know, and I want to point at this stuff and say, you know, you can have all of this, every one of you can have all of this, all you have to do is work your ass off. You know, it's like, it's like, because none of these people got that, by luck. None of these people got that because it just fell into their laps. nobody out there, you know, with these successful businesses is working less than 18 hours a day, nobody playing guitar, that that's just like, killing it, you know, got there without practicing for eight hours a day, at least for years, and years. And so you can have all of that you can be great at whatever it is you love to do. All you have to do. And this is the funny part is work your ass off. You know, and if everyone really understood that, that everything, all your dreams are attainable. Now there are people that can throw up roadblocks, but for the most part, you can really, you can really reach for the stars and get a hold of one if you just work hard enough. And that's really what it takes. And so anybody that thinks, like I used to think when I get into the but I get a record deal and all of that stuff, you know, man, I'll really be able to have the luxury of time to make an album and work on this and spend, you know, years getting this just right. Well, No, you won't. You know, because you're going to be doing 150 shows on the road and they're going to drag you off the road for a quick three month production of your next album. And you're not going to have that luxury you know You're going to be working too hard and doing all of this other stuff. None of what you see, you know, is easy. No matter who you're looking at, you know, you look at all the big stars on tour. You know, there's not a one of them that isn't working their butt off. There is nobody there is nobody having success in this business or any other business who isn't working their butt off. Yeah, that I they asked earlier, this is a podcast, they're working their asses off. And that's, that's important for kids to know, Eddie Van Halen didn't just come by those licks. Right?
Thomas Mooney 1:25:45
Yeah. Yeah,
Clint Black 1:25:47
it's, if you listen to, if you listen to hell bent on this record. I figured from the time that that we first started playing the track and recording it, until the time I delivered it to be mastered. I hit that spacebar for listening or recording at least 1000 times. So what's a you know, four minute song times 1000? That that's minimum. How many minutes went into just the recording and completion of that one song on this record? You know, it's it's, it's not construction work. I've done that. I know how much harder it is. But it's hard work. And, you know, I'm glad you touched on that because I think, you know, anyone who's trying to do anything out there, you know, to look over and think that you know, Hayden, Hayden Nicholas, you know, playing that guitar. I made a joke one night and after some song that he had just killed, you know, playing the guitar, and we had a real intimate crowd and I introduced him I said, he got really lucky on a bunch of those guitar licks just now didn't make. Yeah, that's what it was. Yeah. Yeah. Well,
Thomas Mooney 1:27:13
it's it's one of those things where, you know, whenever you you know, get that record deal or whenever you have that big break, you know, that that's not the the moment of accomplishment. That's like the beginning. Almost. Yeah, you've
Clint Black 1:27:28
been given the big block of granite now go to work. Yeah. Now, now you're gonna start working?
Thomas Mooney 1:27:36
Yeah. Well, Clint, it's been really, really great talking with you today. We have to do this. Yeah,
Clint Black 1:27:42
I enjoyed it. I haven't done a lot of
Thomas Mooney 1:27:45
Deleuze. You know, I'm so here.
Clint Black 1:27:47
Oh, okay. No, I haven't done a lot of podcasts. And it's really, it's really fun. You know, we can can dig deep on this stuff. It's interesting.
Thomas Mooney 1:27:57
Yeah, that's what I love talking with people where, you know, there's not that, like so many people you talk to they're, they're sitting, we'll be right back. Yeah, that radio, where it's like, you can introduce the next single and you're not even really even able to get deep in in the woods there and talk about all the stuff that that got you to that point, you know, so that's what I love. And like I said, like, I think people like that, too. Now, you know it forever, like there was that? Or you only did listen to those little radio clips or whatever. And that's, that are like, you know, you saw them in country weekly, or whatever magazine and, and now I think like, you know, the podcast setting and being able to really deep dive with artists is is really rewarding on my end. I love talking because at the end of the day, I'm a fan. You know, that's
Clint Black 1:28:51
Yeah, we all are. I could do a podcast with James Taylor.
Wear him out.
Yeah, well, man. Well, I appreciate your help with the music and all the good things you said.
Thomas Mooney 1:29:05
Alright, thanks for listening to new slang. Please subscribe if you haven't already. Go check out episode sponsors the blue light live and wickers jalapeno jelly over y'all all have a safe Fourth of July weekend and we will see you next week.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai