057: Sean McConnell
Episode 057 is with songwriter Sean McConnell. We talk about McConnell's latest albums--the full band Sean McConnell and the acoustic version Undone--writing with Randy Rogers, and songwriting in Nashville.
Interview Transcript
Note: Transcripts aren’t always accurate since they are computer automated and haven’t been edited for spelling, grammar, etc.
Thomas Mooney 0:05
Everyone, welcome to episode number 57 of the new slang podcast on Thomas Mooney. On this week's episode, I'm joined by singer songwriter Sean McConnell, who's here in town a few weeks back playing at the blue light. And so we sat down for about 30 minutes after their their soundcheck and, and talked about music and the the progress of his career as a songwriter and artist. You know, we go into the the collaborative efforts that he's had over the years, you know, he's been a longtime co writer of songs with guys like Wade Bowen and Randy Rogers. So we explore that territory as well as one of my favorite, which is a, I guess it's relatively new. He had recorded a song with Lori McKenna, that was on his last album, which was undone, which was a all acoustic record. And so yeah, we talked about that in the making of those records. As well as what he's been doing lately, which has been, he's been working on a new record that is tentatively slated for early 2019. We talked a little bit about that, as well as, like, what he's been doing. As far as you know, he talks about going into the studios as a producer, and like, what, what, what's that likely to be the switching of the hats, if you will be trying to help another artists out as far as finding their sound? And so yeah, like we that's what we really talked about on this episode. I know it's been a minute since the last podcast, but I have a few lined up already here for you this month. And yeah, as far as stuff I've been writing over on wide open country, I've been super busy over there. And this week, right here, you can go over to wide open and see some articles, some interviews that I've done with the with guys like Jason Ed, we have a a song premiere that's out on Tuesday, we have another song premiere with the singer songwriter Israel Nash, who is putting out a new record as well. And then also was able to catch up with Carolina story. Who is this? Really like this? This band built around the duo of Ben and Emily Roberts. They have a new record coming out at the end of the week called lay your head down. And yeah, so last week, I talked with him about the making of that record. And it's a really excellent album. Yeah, these next few months. I have a bunch of stuff going out. Over on wide open country a lot of interviews with with folks like Ben Nichols of Lou Cerro and Lori McKenna, and Ryan Colwell, Kirby Brown, a few other people dirty river boys. All these people have new album's coming out. And yeah, it's an exciting time for for music. So yeah, if you don't follow me on any of the social media, go ahead and do so. I'm on Twitter at underscore new slang. On Facebook, you can find me under new slang. And on Instagram, it's underscore new slang as well. If you haven't rated the the podcast, go ahead and do so give us five stars. It'll help push the podcast to broader horizons. So yeah, here's this interview with Sean McConnell.
Yeah, so, you know, I guess like the most recent thing you did was you released the acoustic undone which was you know, just a, an acoustic record of Holy Days. Yeah. Um, what what was like the deciding factor to do the entire record that way.
Sean McConnell 4:10
Two things one being that I just wanted to, I always heard that record, being like a full blown production record and then also having a version of just being my guitar kind of the way that the songs were conceived and written. And I just like when people do that, you know, a lot of my favorite records growing up you can kind of hear both versions and I always thought that was really cool. Not to mention the fact that I play a lot acoustic solo, right. And I wanted to have something that people could go home with that sounded more like what they had heard that night. So yeah, and just it was just a passion project for me I ever wanted to do it.
Thomas Mooney 4:54
You know, a lot of times when people put out an acoustic record, it's usually you know, a live thing or Yeah, compilation of songs. I think it's really cool that it's an entire record. Yeah. Because I, you know, listening to it. I think like, whenever you think of the idea of somebody putting an acoustic record of an entire record, you think, well, is it going to be the exact same thing? Right, but I think you know, that there's, you know, when he listened through both versions, they like the feel of a whole lot of songs change. Yeah, just without the production behind it.
Sean McConnell 5:28
Yeah, I think they spoke differently, which was fun to be in there and stumble upon something that presented itself, you know, as a new chord or a new way to sing that. Just the nature of playing a song more intimately with just a guitar or a piano. Which was super fun. And then, of course, like playing holy days on the piano and playing Babylon on the Wurlitzer was, you know, really created a whole new emotion to me, like just presenting the lyric vocally, it changed my whole emotion while I was singing the song, which was really fun.
Thomas Mooney 6:06
Right? On holy. Holy Days. It's a lot slower. Yeah, slowed down, and it feels I don't know. Like the the full band version feels really lively and vicarious. Yeah, you know, just really passionate. And this one feels. I don't necessarily want to say reserved, but it feels like you know, the song you go so much into a nostalgic feel. Yeah, and this one feels more like you're looking at like an old Polaroid versus like a being yesterday.
Sean McConnell 6:40
Yeah. Yeah. It feels more melancholy to me, which I really enjoyed. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 6:49
Was it going back and like, feeling the way they they felt when you first were writing them that you were trying to capture? Or did you even venture from that when you recorded an acoustic,
Sean McConnell 7:02
some of them sounded very much like when I had written them at some of them evolved, either on the road playing acoustic, or even in the studio while I was recording the record, just stumbling upon, like I said before, like a different core. That might have been an accident. But it's like, Oh, that sounds cool. So there's a little bit about, like, things that I learned while I was on the road, and then things that happened while we were in the studio.
Thomas Mooney 7:27
You know, I think that record holy days, I don't even know what really to call it holy days around done. It's just self titled, but I've always kind of thought about it. Oh, yeah, I guess it is. Yeah. I think that so many of those songs really play into the nostalgic atmosphere. Yeah. It does feel a little bit more. I don't want to say happy but it feels a little bit more happy than previous work. more happy you're saying? Yeah, like, it just feels like a lot of them feel like good memories. Yeah. Versus maybe some, some moments of like, you know, that melancholy? Yeah, on previous albums, right. I guess like, what was that batch of songs? Like, what like, Did you feel like these songs were all kind of going in that direction that
Sean McConnell 8:17
it definitely felt like, as I was writing, that there was like a common thread of a very autobiographical nature. So I think a lot of that record, it was really like an exploration of my history, as a person as musician, as, you know, as a dad as a husband as a son. So yeah, there was definitely a threat of that. And I think there are Yeah, there are more happy moments on that record than past records for sure. Which is nice. Because, you know, you sometimes you need some happy songs.
Thomas Mooney 8:59
Yeah. Because I feel like, like best we've ever been. Yeah, just feels like a, like a feel good song. Yeah. You know, is that is that very much a, you know, just inspired by real life?
Sean McConnell 9:15
Yeah, I wrote that song for my wife for our 10 year wedding anniversary. And so that's just a straight up love song to my wife. So yeah, all all true. That record was very much a, for the most part, just a very literal, honest, lyrical execution, you know, there's not much not much imagination on that record. It's very just kind of true to the stories for the most part. Yeah, yeah. I
Thomas Mooney 9:45
think a lot of people think you know, whenever someone says this is a very personal record, it's, they just automatically relate it to like a struggle that somebody has gone through, or a hard time right, but like this feels like the opposite. Yeah. You know, you just kind of going into old memories versus creating bad, sad narratives or something. Yeah.
Sean McConnell 10:08
Yeah, I think there's some of that. I mean, there are some, you know, sad memories on that record for sure. It kind of dips into that a little bit. But yeah, a lot of good stuff.
Thomas Mooney 10:18
Also on undone though, you have the duet with Lori McKenna. Yeah. How long have you known Laurie? Man, I don't know. I, I,
Sean McConnell 10:28
I want to say maybe eight years or so. Maybe seven years.
I was a fan first. Obviously, I just love her music and everything that she does. And we're both from Massachusetts, but we didn't meet there. I can't remember how we met probably writing a song or through a friend. But yeah, I definitely. Definitely consider her a good friend at this point. And I just respect her so much as a person. And obviously, she's one of my absolute favorite songwriters of all time. And I really mean that.
Thomas Mooney 11:00
Yeah, I absolutely love her too. I think she does. Something that like she, one of her strongest points, I feel is the way she characterizes the passage of time. Yeah. Like, it feels like she can do both the where it feels like, you know, we're days like just kind of drag on but like, then that years fly by? It's it's kind of that vibe. Yeah. I think like on this record, on the last record, you have, though, you really have some of those moments, too. Yeah. What was it like writing this? Nothing on you with her.
Sean McConnell 11:37
It was awesome that we wrote. I was up in Massachusetts with her for, I think two or three days. And we wrote, we probably wrote four or five songs. And that was one that I just remember being like, Oh, my gosh, we have to do something with this. And I think we talked about putting it on the self titled record, and it didn't fit or there was one too many that I don't know, it would have been great on that record. But I don't remember why we didn't put it on there. But when the acoustic record came up, I was like, Oh, perfect. This is why, you know, it was meant for this record. And I was so happy that she decided to do it with me.
Thomas Mooney 12:19
When you go into like a co write like that, like what? What are your expectations? Like? Do you you kind of like go in there prepped with? Okay, I've got like these five ideas. We can go down or like what what's like your typical kind of write game plan, I guess? You know,
Sean McConnell 12:34
I used to come in with ideas more than I do now. Like, I've been co writing for 1112 years. And early on, you know, they always tell you, like go in with an idea. Which I think is great. I mean, that's great. But I also think that some of my favorite songs are probably most of my favorite songs are just things that happened. Like, when two people go into a room to write a song. It's almost just not up to you guys, what you write, you know, like, I think there's a certain amount of as far out as it seems like the muse, you know, showing up and informing you of No, actually, this is what you're going to write today. And I like I really like writing with people who feel the same way to allow that space for. We don't have this end goal of like, we have to write this song today. But let's just feel out the room and see what's supposed to happen. And Laurie, obviously, is one of those people for sure. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 13:35
Like what? I'm just so fascinated with like the the the CO right, collaboration, yeah, pieces, because it's like, it's obviously two people going into your room and creating something that wasn't there before. Right? Like, if you if I was like a fly on the wall kind of thing, like how much communication is happening? Is there like periods of, of you know, like, where you guys are just both thinking in your head? And not really? Yeah, and one another? Like, what's the?
Sean McConnell 14:02
Yeah, I think so. I mean, I think in like a nice, healthy co write situation where there's not a bunch of pressure built around it. If you're with somebody that especially someone that you know, and you've written with before, there are definitely if you were to like, look in, like you said, like, as a fly on the wall, you'd probably see minutes that go by of just two people strumming and thinking to themselves, and then they say, oh, what about this? And then everyone gets excited, like, or not, you know, and you kind of move on. But yeah, I mean, I think it's a lot of spoken and spoken and just musical melodies, informing you of maybe what the song could be about and communicating that. So it's an interesting it's a very interesting situation.
Thomas Mooney 14:51
Because I don't know like if you I know that like you know a lot of guys or a lot of songwriters, they always kind of If they think of something clever as far as the line, you know, though, have that Rolodex of lines. Yeah, like, you know, can spark a song or, you know, how much of that goes into it, where you're, let's say you're working on something with somebody, and then you're like, well, I may have something that kind of fits that.
Sean McConnell 15:16
Yeah. I think there's certain writers that really come with a list of like, hooks, or titles or ideas of topics they want to write about. And sometimes that can be really good. And kind of save the day. But I don't know more lately, and I don't co write as much as I used to, I do less and less of it these days. So the people I tend to write with, it's more of the, let's just show up and write a good song, you know, and sometimes that is like someone to be like, I had this title. And now we'll get excited about it. Like, yeah, let's write that. Sometimes it's more freeing to just write without knowing where you're headed. It kind of leaves it lets the imagination feel its way through the day a little bit better. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 16:09
You know, like, one of your early co writes, as far as getting into Texas, seeing was like Randy Rogers, and yeah, Wade Bowen, like, what were those kind of early, I say early days, but doesn't feel like that long ago. Like, what was a, I guess, like working with those, like, with Randy, like, what's that kind of process,
Sean McConnell 16:27
Randy specifically was
we've always written really easily together. And that's not always the case with other people that you co write with. But we've always had a really easy go of it, which I try not to think too hard about, and just let it be what it is, you know, but from day one, I mean, it was really, really easy and fun. And we continue to do it a couple times a year. And it's a really fun, you know, he's a good buddy of mine now, too. But it's also just a really fun musical relationship, because it always seems to, always seems to work, which is, you know, nice.
Thomas Mooney 17:13
Yeah. Because I'm one of those guys who, you know, just studies the, the, you know, the songwriting credits. Yeah. All that kind of stuff. And, you know, when you go back on those old records, you're like, oh, who's the Sean McConnell guy? And then, you know, yeah, kind of, like trying to figure out who you are. Right? And, you know, I guess like, what is like, what's the, the Texas circuit, if you will? What's that done to your career? Do you feel a lot,
Sean McConnell 17:44
I mean, a whole lot, I, I came down here. However, many years ago, I can't really remember now, I think it's been probably almost 10 years, at least, to open up for Wade Bowen for a couple of weeks. And it really snowballed after that just pretty quickly to the point where I just made it a priority to keep coming back. There was a few years where I was driving from Nashville to Texas, you know, 789 10, you know, 789 10 times a month for a few years, you know, and just really kept coming back and people kept bringing their friends and it created a whole, you know, world of music for me that I didn't plan on, which is really cool, you know? Yeah. And just being part of the family down here is really important to me. And I really value my friendships with guys like Wade and Randy and you know, a million other guys that have been super good to me. Let me open we write songs together and formed actual friendships now where we you know, keep in touch and are part of each other's lives. But yeah, I'm very honored to to have been you know, accepted down here and for people to continue to show up to the shows like they do.
Thomas Mooney 19:07
Yeah, I think like you're one of these like, you're a valued part of the the Texas scene simply because first off, you're really great, but like, I think like you've helped broaden the the sonic palette of a whole lot of fans, you know, you're not really like Randy or Wade, or, or a lot of these, you know, the, the, the staples of the scene, but I think it helps broaden people's Sonic palette there. You know, what kind of music they like, you know, I think that's, it's helped the, I guess broaden people's taste, if you will. I've always been
Sean McConnell 19:55
grateful for that. You know, for it does. It's not exactly like the scene. And yet people have really embraced it. And I think that's really cool. I mean, I think it falls under the category of, you know, a true music fan is just good music is good music. Right? Those lines are being blurred everywhere. Right now with music. You know, from Texas to anywhere. I think good music is good music and bad, right?
Thomas Mooney 20:25
I mean, like I there's still like the stigma about people from Nashville. Yeah, here for whatever reason. And obviously, I think it's a dumb thing. Because it's like, these are the all the Texas guys are going up to Nashville and recording records and yeah, songs with people up there. And, you know, Nashville guys are coming down here and playing. So like, what's, what's the difference? Really? But yeah, I don't know, for, for whatever reason, people kind of hold on to that, like it's Yeah. 70s Wayland versus I don't know. You know what I mean?
Sean McConnell 20:58
I know. And I it's frustrating, because it just makes me a little bit sad. I guess. It's like, it's just one more way that people are dividing right themselves. And, you know, it's like the TV if you don't like what's on this station, you change it? Yeah. So if you don't like a certain artists from Nashville or from Texas, you don't have to listen to them. Yeah. But there doesn't need to be this like, animosity between two states. You know, I find that just divisive. I don't think that's helpful to anybody.
Thomas Mooney 21:31
No, I know. Exactly. I agree with you. I think that like, one of the things that perplexes me is, whenever somebody doesn't like something online, and then like, you, they just comment about how they don't like it. But I mean, like, I'm just like, why do you? Why is that bothering you? Yeah, we're not like I okay, if it does bother you. Why are you like, putting that? so much? so much energy into that? Yeah,
Sean McConnell 21:59
I know, man. It's like the troll thing. It's like, why? Who is this person that has so much time on their hands? And is so hell bent? On like saying, I don't like this with no constructive information behind it. It's just like, they're vomiting. Yeah, online. It's like, what? Like,
Thomas Mooney 22:18
I think if people realize that, what they're doing is they're giving that person who they apparently don't like, power over them. Like, I don't know, it's just this weird. Yeah. I don't know. It's not helpful. Yeah. But, uh, what do you what do you have coming up? Like, what's, what are you working on now,
Sean McConnell 22:36
I've actually been home, I've been off the road for a few months working on a new record that I I'm almost finished with. And we're in the middle of figuring out, you know, how we're going to put it out and how it's going to work, but very, very excited about it. So I've been doing that. And I've been producing a record for an artist and a dear friend of mine named Ashley Ray, which will be coming out soon. So I've been in a season of being in the studio and creating music and being home with my family, which has been really nice. And now we're kind of going back into that touring season. Right? So yeah, that's what I've been up to.
Thomas Mooney 23:21
Obviously, whenever you're writing your own material, and you're prepping your own record, and in the studio, you're you do have, even if you have a producer on you, you still have to be that producer mind for your own stuff. Yeah, how different is it to transition to working with somebody else, whether it's somebody else's songs and somebody else's
Sean McConnell 23:40
record, you almost have more perspective. Because when you're producing your own record, which is what I just did it you know, there are so many pros, but maybe one of the cons is the, you know, the bird's eye view of the project, you get so deep into it, that you have to find ways to, you know, rise above it and look down on it and assess, like, what's going on, or does it need was it not need? I think when you're producing and other artists, you almost automatically have that perspective already. Which is nice, you know, I think that might be one of the differences.
Thomas Mooney 24:23
It feels like, you know, talking with a lot of different bands, they talked about the the, like the grape producers always tell you, like, you know, when you're, I guess like if you're in a band or whatever, and you're working on the songs, and sometimes you can just feel like you're in a box like you're in a circle together and then, you know, you're not really seeing how it looks from like the next room over, if you will, that sometimes it's it needs you need that person to say, yeah, keep on doing That were like, No, no, no, that's Yeah. gonna work on for for whatever reason, you know?
Sean McConnell 25:05
Yeah, yeah, I think that voice can go a long way. Sometimes you just need someone to reinforce that like, no, that sounds great or no, why would you? You shouldn't racing that that sounds great. Like Don't overthink it. I think that's an important and important part of the producer's role is, is to be that person to
Thomas Mooney 25:26
whenever you're like prepping a record, like how many songs do you typically? Do you try and get to like a certain number that you're like, Okay, let's, I've got 30 songs, and let's dwindle it down Is there like a fitness or the magic number, but is there like, a comfortable amount that you like to get to choose from whenever you're, I think, for me,
Sean McConnell 25:50
right now, like 10, or 11 songs is a nice full record that people can still sit down and listen to. I mean, there are exceptions to that there's plenty of awesome records that 1215 songs on him, I normally for whatever reason, tend to like to put out 10 or 11 songs. And, but to get to those 10 or 11 songs, I might write 50 songs, you know, or more throughout the year. I mean, definitely more throughout the year, but like songs that I might actually consider for my record, there might be 30 or 40 of them. And then you whittle them down to like, which ones are actually like a belong together and be just, you feel like are great songs. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 26:32
Is there any time where it feels like, this is a great song, but it doesn't fit with the? Yeah. What is that, like books that struggle of?
Sean McConnell 26:44
Yeah, choose? That's definitely a thing. Yeah, it's not. I feel like it's important to try to make a record feel cohesive, for me, at least. And so there's definitely songs I've written that are either like, almost a different genre or something where we either have to produce them the right way, or they just might not be for this record type of a situation. So I definitely keep my eye on that. Like, I want all the songs to fit together, I want I don't want someone to listen from top to bottom and be like, this is five different records in one, right. Which maybe that's fine for someone else. There's just one of my things that I try to do. So yeah, when that happens, I'm always like, well, maybe this is for the next record. When there's a really good song, you don't forget it, you hold on to it and try to find a way to put it out, you know?
Thomas Mooney 27:34
Yeah. Well, like, how, how often does it Where Is there any examples of having like a song where you did feel strongly about it? didn't put it out thought like, maybe you come on something later. But then, you know, you just your I don't know, maybe like the way you feel about it changes the maybe like you lose some passion? You don't connect with it as much. Yeah, is what happened? Like, is there any examples of that ever happening?
Sean McConnell 28:03
I don't know about a specific example. But that's definitely a common thing. I mean, I think when you're writing a song, you're all in it, and you're excited about it. Obviously, you wouldn't be like, writing if you weren't stoked about it. But then maybe like, you wake up the next morning, you're like, wow, this is a piece of shit. Like, I this is not as good as I thought it was right? That is definitely happened to me and countless other people. It's, you know, the morning after, listen, and you're like, wow, I thought I was doing really good. And I was way off the mark. Yeah, I mean, I don't have a specific example. But that happens all the time.
Thomas Mooney 28:46
Yeah. Do you? Is there any one specific that you're like? If you're, I don't know. Like that you show first that you try and like, test the waters with anyone specific that you that you'll send that song? No, like, specific person that you'll be like, Hey, how's it sound?
Sean McConnell 29:06
Oh, like who would? Who would I ask? Like, you got like a? Yeah, yesterday, I guess. I mean, my wife, for sure. And then my manager, Ross Duprey is a is a very good judge of an equality song. And him and I are cut from a very similar cloth musically, which is really nice that we see eye to eye on, you know, on on music. So there are two very, you know, strong voices for sure.
Thomas Mooney 29:35
Yeah. It's one of those things where I can just assume that you can't just show your mom or your grandma because they're like rice is amazing. Yeah, amazing.
Sean McConnell 29:44
Yeah, you need someone who's going to tell you like That's horrible. More like yeah, that's just not I don't get it. You know?
Thomas Mooney 29:49
Yeah. I have a lot of those people which is nice. You were you mentioned a minute ago about how you know you you'd like to make records that are cohesive that that feel like they're all part of the same fabric. You will know a lot of times are the artists there they those first records they put out they kind of venture in different directions just because they don't necessarily know what they want to do. Yeah, what's, what's their style? What's their sound? Yeah. What was that? Like? When you when you're first starting out? What what kind of experimentation did you go into? Before you found like your, your sound?
Sean McConnell 30:31
Man, I still don't know that I found my sound. To be honest with you, I have no idea. I love so many different genres and styles. And when people ask me that, inevitably asked me that question like, what kind of music you play? I, I really don't know any more what to say. I mean, that being said, I think I know more than I might have when I was like 15 or 16. But I don't know, I try not to get caught up in it. I try to just write whatever is coming out of me that day, and then go on to the next thing, you know, I don't know if it's my job to put it in a box and run it and but I think as you evolve as a songwriter, and as a musician, you know, there's a there's a certain amount of identity that you do, you know, slowly gain. And, but that's still a thing for me. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know how to classify it.
Thomas Mooney 31:33
I would kind of assume that's what it would be like, you're just kind of always still a journey. Yeah. But like, you know, that you kind of see a little bit more of the path. Yeah, you're a little bit more comfortable with the direction you're going. I guess you know what I mean? Yeah. I think that can change from record to record to well, for this new record, like what you said, you're kind of like in the middle of it. Or Yeah, I'm almost done with it. It's almost finished. What is uh, I don't know, like your expectations on I know, you don't have like a release date or anything like that. Well, what are you kind of thinking? Oh, it should,
Sean McConnell 32:10
we're hoping that it's out, like first quarter of next year. And maybe, maybe have a single out before then leading up to it. But I don't know if that'll happen or not. We're still very much, you know, planning how that's gonna work. But hopefully, you know, first couple months next year is when it'll be fully available.
Thomas Mooney 32:29
Yeah. Well, we're looking forward to hearing it. Appreciate it. I'm excited. Yeah. Well, yeah. Thank you so much for coming on. Yeah. Thanks for having me. It's fun. Yeah, we'll have to have you next time you come through again. I love it. Awesome.
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