048: Shane Smith & The Smith
On Episode 48, we’re joined by Texas singer-songwriter Shane Smith of Shane Smith & The Saints. A few weeks back, Smith and company were playing the latest Blue Light Street Show (others playing were Randy Rogers Band and Aaron Einhouse). We sat on the back patio for a while discussing the band’s upcoming full-length album, frontier songs, expanding the sonic palette, and hear a few road stories.
Interview Transcript
Note: Transcripts aren’t always accurate since they are computer automated and haven’t been edited for spelling, grammar, etc.
Thomas Mooney 0:02
Everyone, welcome to episode number 48 of the new slang podcast. This week we have Shane Smith of Shane Smith and the saints on. They were in town a few weeks back whenever they were playing a street show here at blue light. And so we went to the back patio for a while and talked. There are a couple of breaks in this interview because we did like the first 15 minutes before soundcheck, and then we ended up taking a little bit of a break and then coming back and recording the rest of it. And then there's like another time where like someone came up to get a guitar signed. So you'll you'll hear those little breaks in there. But yeah, it was really, really great interview or conversation. We talk a lot about the upcoming new record that they're going to be putting out pretty soon. We talked about Shane's first record, the Texas music scene in general. And yeah, just I don't know. You'll hear it. I guess you'll hear what we talked about. Yeah, as far as wide open country stuff that I've written lately. I do have a Robert okene. Like an hour long q&a coming out pretty soon. It should be out Tuesday. We just talked about for like I said like an hour talking about burying Robert O'Kane about songwriting. Early records, late records. Yeah, there's also like this piece that I did on while love it's step inside this house. It's a 20 year old record all already now was released in 98. And, yeah, I just think it's like a really important record. So I wrote like a track by track guide, kind of reminding you if you forgot about the record, kind of like where all those connecting points are in it. And if you've never heard of it, you know, it's a really great introduction to go and discover it. We're gonna keep this real short. If you haven't already subscribed to the podcast, go ahead and do so. rate the podcast on iTunes, give us a five star review. Write something nice about us. And yeah, tell all your friends and whatnot. Okay, so here's this podcast conversation with Shane Smith.
It's been a minute. Yeah, I know. Have you bent on not too bad? You've been busy doing the same old? Yeah, same thing, basically. Well, that's a good thing. Busy is good. So you guys have like this new record? In the can right? Yeah, it's like all do do. What? That's the thing is like, it feels like always like the the recording part is the the short part. And then it's all getting all the ducks in a row. Yeah, that's the long part.
Shane Smith 3:25
Yeah, yeah, I think you're totally right. With our latest album, Geronimo, it was actually it wasn't necessarily like that, because it took us forever to record it. And we recorded while on the road, like, you know, over different states and you would be booking studio time, on the same days that we had gigs at night and doing studio work in the morning like random. Yeah, I remember just a terrible way of doing a record but it ended up being cool because you know, you can hear parts of it where it's like, you know, I can remember being in like a living room in Nashville and fiddle part gut tract or, you know, whatever and and then another part will be in Austin or San Marcos or Dallas or whatever. And so that made it cool. But this one, this new one we recorded legitimately, I think in 10, in like a 10 day session, or, like 13 days or something like that in Austin is really neat. It was the first time we've ever gotten to work with a you know, like a really experienced producer. That's worked with a lot of people. And in we've we flew him in from Los Angeles with his engineer, his name is Martin Needham. And he's like a big rock. I don't know like, he works with a lot of indie rock bands, and he had a lot to do with like, Imagine Dragons and the killers and those People getting, you know, recorded and their consignment deals and stuff like that. And, and those is really well known for his mixing and stuff. But it was, it was super cool working with him because I think he kind of pushed us as a live band to, you know, try to see what we'd be capable of accomplishing, like tracking live. And, and that was a really good way of doing it. I think for us. In the past, it's kind of, a lot of times you find yourself frankensteining songs together in studios. And I think, you know, some people realize that a lot of people probably don't realize that, that that's kind of the day and age we live in is where, you know, everything you hear on the radio is pretty much like Frankenstein together, a lot of it is you know, and I mean, Mark had us track everything pretty much live with like all of us in in booths are in like a big room in a room. And I mean, even vocals where he's using, like our harmony vocals and stuff for like, 58 beta, they're just, you know, sure 50, eights in a live room, live with the drums and everything. So it was just really neat, the way that that whole process went down, and it felt really natural, I think for us, because that's kind of our thing is the live show. And we've worked really, really hard throughout the years, just touring a lot and playing a lot of live shows. And so that, that felt really a lot more natural to us, I think being in the studio, being challenged with that, you know, and performing it live, and how well can you execute it live, as opposed to making it feel natural, but building it up, you know, one track at a time. And, and, and a lot of it he even did without a click track like without even a metronome. And so it's like, there's like push and pull and the tempo and parts and, and I thought it was really neat. I'm very excited about the album. And we've just, we're kind of in the mix phase right now. And in going back and forth on mix edits, and there's some stuff I think we were gonna go back in and maybe re record little parts or whatever. But for the most part, yeah, it's like, we have a, we have a full length album, and we're kind of focused on putting the right team together and, and, and, you know, having discussions on how, how big of a release, do we do we want to make it and you know, do we want to? What do we want to do with our career path with the album? You know?
Thomas Mooney 7:38
Yeah, one of the things that, I think is I guess, like invigorated country, and Americana music lately has been when these country or roots rock bands, work with guys with a typically typically like a rock and roll background. You know, on the large scale, it's like Dave Cobb. Right, right. But even like flatland, their record, the two things they've done has been with Scott Ferris here in town, and he's got, like, you know, rock and roll background? And it sounds kind of similar to for sure. Yeah, I think it helps challenge and like, they approach songs in a, in a different way that make things maybe a little bit. Punch better sonically and reassure.
Shane Smith 8:27
Yeah, I think it's good to, you know, as a musician, it's like, I mean, I personally think that's a really cool thing to, to mix it up a little bit, you know, work with people outside of your element. And in the, in the long run, I think you're going to benefit 100% whether that's songwriting, or it's recording, or producing, or Yeah, you know, jamming I mean, like on any level, you know, you surround yourself with a different, some different stuff. It's gonna, it's gonna shake things up a little bit, and it's gonna be good for you. And yeah, Mark is it's actually Andrew, who's Martin marks manager is he works with Dave Cobb as well, I think is another one of his one of his producers and, and so yeah, they're all I think, kind of in a little circle together. And but I definitely, I definitely see what you're saying though, and I totally agree with you on that, because it's good to. It's good to mix it up different genres.
Thomas Mooney 9:36
I guess like, you know, drama, I always think of that being I'm always bad with timing. So I'm like that, that came out just like last year, but now it's
Shane Smith 9:44
now it's like, two and a half years. Yeah, something like that. Yeah, crazy.
Thomas Mooney 9:49
You guys kind of just exploded with that record, though. And I think like now you guys are you know, obviously people are anticipating this release. Are you Do somebody who like always has kind of writing On what? On for like, what the next record was going to be since drama? Or did you just kind of collect ideas and then try and knock them out in a short amount of time? As far as like finishing?
Shane Smith 10:14
You're saying on the songwriting? Yeah, have them all knocked out leading up to the album, man. Well,
Thomas Mooney 10:19
no, like, for this new record, did you? Have you? Have you been writing continuously since drama? Or do you kind of go in like little phases of spurts
Shane Smith 10:29
phases, honestly, I mean, it's just time with me and finding the time and finding the Yeah. And what I like to do is like, build up kind of like a bank of, you know, voice memos or notes, and, you know, all kinds of stuff, and then all sudden, like, I'll find myself with time. And then I can just, like, dive into all of it. And just kind of, it's just, it's a weird thing, because it's like, when you do that, it really is a totally different mindset that you get into, and you kind of drop into, like a, just a different way of thinking, and, and it's a trip because I'm pretty sure like, every time I do that I get you get so caught up with the business side of things, because this is a business, it's an operation, it's competitive, it's, you know, it's, there's a lot of moving parts with this whole thing. And it's really easy to get caught up with that. And when I drop into the hole songwriter, mode, and I have time to do that, I find myself just totally re inspired and kind of rejuvenated. As to why I love this so much. And like, you know, what I truly, what I truly love, I think is down to the writing side of it. And, and it's weird because I don't get to write that often. Like, if I'm being totally honest. And and that's my fault, because I like I get tied up with way too much, you know, the business side of it. And, you know, my wife and like having a life, you know, outside of the music and trying to write trying to just balance as much as I can and and that's a it's just a whole other job in itself. for building our first house right now, and I'm just like, ready to just jump off a cliff. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 12:24
Yeah, I can't imagine the the stress that goes with this. building a house. It's all good, man. It's exciting. Yeah, a note on on house building, though. I remember one of my aunts and her, her and her husband decided to build a house. And he's just like, frugal is shit, like, just cheap and totally killed, you're gonna go like, Oh, this is like another level. He was wanting to like, he asked if, if they could finish out like part of the house and live in that part and then finish the rest. And they're like, No, you can't do that. Like, no, there's. And he was wanting to like, finish out like the, the living room and the bedroom and then kind of like work on the rest of it. Like, and they had like twins and a toddler at the age at that time. And it's like, you can't do that. No,
Shane Smith 13:17
that's amazing. Dude, I could totally see myself if I wasn't married alone. I could totally see myself like, trying to pull that conversation off, you know? Yeah. But there's no way I could get away with it. That's awesome.
Thomas Mooney 13:32
Yeah, but I digress. Yeah, like so much of the of Geronimo. I thought was so you went into all these? I felt like it was like Appalachian frontier music, you know, like you, it felt like everything kind of came out of the 1800s is felt soaked with time? Yeah. Is that something that you kind of were, or have been continuing to seek out or it's
Shane Smith 14:01
man, I don't know, it's like I get I get inspired by a lot of different, you know, levels of things. And I think on this next album, I found myself like years leading up to right now not writing very much stuff that was very melodic, like, it was melodic, but it's like, there's not necessarily things that you want to like sing along with and there's not you know, and like, on a really folk level of music. You know, that it's so melodic it's Yes, it is the storytelling and I think that part I got down you know, is like, that's what I was first really inspired by and like, and I think I really pursued that hard and Geronimo and there was a lot of like, stories behind some of those songs and from like, crocketts prayer with like Texas history all the way to like, you know, like, you know, part fiction part nonfiction storytelling with like them. Mountain and like coming up with these like scenarios and you know, it's like the storytelling thing. But within those songs, there's not necessarily too much, you know, Melody to just, like, really just fall into the song if you're not hearing every single word of it, right? And a lot of people do they listen to music, and they don't necessarily pick out words, right. And that's okay. I mean, everybody's different. With this album, I think that with the songs that I was working with, they were, I was really wanting to, like, push myself on, like, trying to be significantly more melodic to where it's like, he listened to it, you just kind of like fall into the melody of the song, you know, and, and in the past, I think that's something I haven't been very solid at as a songwriter. And so I wanted to try to challenge myself a little bit with that. And, and, in Aside from that, it was me wanting to, as usual, like I really wanted to try to capture the live that band sound. And and I think we, I think we did that, for the most part. It's a very, it's a big sounding album, like, I mean, it's think it's a very full big sounding album, there are some songs that are just straight up like, rock, but it's, it's our style of rock, you know, if you've been to our show, there's a difference in like rock music and like, playing your heart out on stage and just going into like, a big halftime jam and stuff like that. And that's what I refer to. When I say rock, you know, it's like, the stuff we do live at shows. I was really trying to capture that on this album. And and, yeah, I mean, it's, there's I definitely don't think there's anything on it that I'm gonna regret. You know, it might be a little bit different for some of our fans. The fans that were that are like, just totally sold on, like, just songs like dance the night away, and like, don't really care as much for like,
I don't know.
If you like, you know, like the song we cover at our live show, and I'm talking to you, you Yes, friend, a friend. Like you've been to a lot of our shows. Yeah, you know how like, we play like hurricane, we've played that song, we've covered that song livan home recorded the band recorded it. We we play ours, our version of it kind of the way like the band recorded there. I'm sorry, that band heathens Yeah. recorded. And if you like the way we play that song live, you'll probably like this album a whole lot. Because it's a lot of songs like that with with a lot of energy and a lot of four part courses that are more melodic big courses, like anthem courses. And so you know, we got to see how it all comes out. And which songs actually go on it and which songs don't go on it. But, you know, all in all, that's kind of where I was with it. Like going into it. It's not the same vibe is like I wouldn't say it's the same vibe as like the mountain because the mountain was truly I wanted to write like an Appalachian him. You know, it was like, very directional towards Yeah, towards that. And, and this one, it's like the four part harmony stuff. You hear that kind of Celtic, like, like, fiddle riff influence throughout throughout this record some, but it's not as like direct sounding is like Appalachian, or like anything like that. It's not, there's not really any bluegrass songs on it. If that makes sense. It's more it's it's a lot more like our live show as a whole. I think. Yeah, if you were to average the live show. Yes, it has,
Thomas Mooney 19:04
you know, I've always compared the mountain to and I've asked you this, I asked you this on the the first one I was like, is that like, token inspired? Because it sounds like but you know, it's very
Shane Smith 19:14
much like there is like a fantastical type. You know, writing to it, I think and and, and I think that's cool. You know, I love that type of stuff, too. I mean, it's definitely wasn't intentional, when, at the same time as just I don't know, the whole metaphorical thing with like, you know, a mineshaft and like a hole in the side of a mountain being portrayed as a dragon's mouth with smoke coming out of it because there's a fire in the coal mines. You know, like, yeah, that is fantastical, but it's also just another metaphor. Yeah, you know what I mean?
Thomas Mooney 19:59
Yeah, we We've run like 18 minutes if you want to.
So like the the four part harmonies is such a big piece of the puzzle. And we talked a little bit about how it's not necessarily something that you were writing towards these pieces that turn into these moments, right. But, you know, you guys have been in a been a band together for a while now. Has that like, has that changed up a little bit where you do think of the you can hear the, for sure,
Shane Smith 20:35
the harmonies in your head before you even? Yeah, there's a song called Oklahoma City that I that I that's going to be on this next album. And that was one of those things I was definitely thinking of, like, throughout the process of writing that is big four part harmonies on it and on the choruses. And, yeah, I mean, there's there's even a side of me, that's kind of like, wanting to write some stuff away from the four part harmonies, because we branded so much and because, you know, it's like, you don't want that to just be like, yeah, so accessible just all the time. It's like, it's a cool thing. And it stays cool by not having it just everywhere all the time. Yeah. And I mean, of course, yeah. And so I think that's something we got to we got to watch, we got to make sure that we don't overdo that. But it to answer your question. Yeah, absolutely. I think about it. Now. I think about everything down to like, a fiddle riff and like, down to, like, you know, we need to have a song that like, literally starts with X, Y, and Z and, or whatever, with a particular instrumental part or something, you know. But, you know, at one time, no, I wouldn't, I probably wasn't thinking about the four part. But now that we've been touring with it so much, like, you know, you start to write stuff, you know, with that in mind that that's like a tool that you that you can use and utilize. So you kind of instinctively I think start writing like that a little bit.
Thomas Mooney 22:22
Yeah. But you know, it is one of those things. Like, if you listen to any of the great singers, they're not belting out all the damn time. They're pulling back. Right, right. And then like those moments, when those moments happen, they're big, you know, and that you feel, I guess, yeah, you have to kind of approach it the same way.
Shane Smith 22:39
Yeah, you're totally right. And I've never really thought of it like that. But you're, you're absolutely correct. Like, you know, there are those climactic moments and it has to be dynamic. It can't just be just, you know, pedal to the metal all the time. And, and yeah, it applies with everything. Yeah.
Thomas Mooney 22:59
Now, one of the things you just said there that was really interesting is the, you're thinking of that it feels like you're thinking of the songs. Not in like the final form, when you start out, but like you're thinking of all of the, the blueprints Oh, yeah. And I know, like, a lot of people really think of just when they're starting out writing a song, they're thinking of just how they played acoustic, you know, what I mean? versus how the band is going to turn this acoustic song into a full band piece feels like you're thinking like, about all the, for lack of a better term, like all the little stuff that you guys do? Well,
Shane Smith 23:42
yeah, like being able to put it into and, and I don't come up with the majority and stuff. You know, it's like, I've just started, I think, to write more. And I wouldn't say that I haven't just started to do that. I've, that's been one of those things that I think I kind of get a picture in my head and I try to try to write towards that direction. And even from like, before I had a band, I think I was doing that some like, oh, man, it'd be so cool if we could have this or that or whatever. Yeah, and I'm like riding for that. But it just depends on the song. There are some songs that are just written as a song, like, down to its core, just an acoustic guitar or a piano and a vocal and lyrics and a story or whatever. And that is what, that's all I care about, you know, like when I'm writing it, and there's others that are Yeah, it's more of a, like trying to, I'm like thinking up this blueprint as a whole and I'm trying to like, piece it together. You know, with that, that whole kind of blueprint in mind off the bat, if that makes sense. So So yeah, I Just a bunch of different ways to do it. And I try to mix it up the best I can, I guess.
Thomas Mooney 25:03
Yeah. Now, what's your first record called?
Shane Smith 25:06
Like the very first one, the very first one. We actually don't sell anymore. You might be able to get it on iTunes. But it is I'll see the miles and that was recorded.
I guess it was like 2000 that's the one we're like cops and county blues, right? Kaufman county lions County?
Thomas Mooney 25:29
Because that one like, that's like the if there's like any tests of the if there's like the Shane Smith fan base, if they know about that record, then like they, they you. They hold their head a little bit higher. Yeah, totally. You're totally right in that little bit of like, snobbish kind of way, not like an asshole but like a little bit more like for sure. For sure. I've heard like, you know, a lot of people request that song even here. And you're always like, how do you guys know this?
Shane Smith 26:02
Right? Yeah. Somebody the other night, like, requested? What was it? Indian song, which is a song that I wrote about the Trail of Tears. That's on that album. And I just started laughing. I was like, What the hell are you talking about? Like, I haven't played that song. And, you know, so many years. And like, you know, I'd have to like, freshen up on the lyrics myself. Like, But, anyways, yeah, it's a it's a trip, man, when, when you have something out like that, that, you know, you don't really perform any of it. It's kind of like your first shot at recording at a young age. And then you go for it. And, and it's like, it's always right there. Like, there's that one fan every night, like yelling out. Yeah. Or whatever. And it's like, I love that, you know, I love it. Because it's, it's like, you know, it's like young singer songwriter, like totally raw, you know, just trying to do a lot of storytelling. I mean, it's totally like a storytelling album, like for fans of ours, that, that just love the storytelling aspect of, of our music. You know, and they're willing to listen to me when I like, sounded really bad. Not that I sound good now, but like, it was just his, you know, I was not very talented. And yeah, that would be a good album for him to try to track down. And that's why
Thomas Mooney 27:42
it's one of my favorite things to do is like, find out what like the first record is because a lot of times people will take those off iTunes or, obviously they go out of print. You don't get a bunch more made up and, and it's like, you find them on Amazon or on eBay. And they're like, 500 bucks or something like that. You're like,
Shane Smith 28:02
who who's selling these? It's like the ryan being in like, the wishbone saloon record. They
Thomas Mooney 28:08
talked to him about that. And he was like, about that whole thing, because like, he's got a he had a couple before mescaline. Oh, that. He said, like one of his uncle's probably still has copies of them. And I was like, you need to get those reissued or something like, yeah, we'll buy those up. And he's like, Yeah, I know. It's so surprising because no, we couldn't give them away at the beginner. You know, there's no way that these people would even take them in right now. Like they're 500 like Turnpike's first record. Go and find that, like, that's a that's one. That's 100 bucks somewhere.
Shane Smith 28:41
Yeah. Total, I remember that. When we first started playing with him. They had that and every time I'd like, talk to him about it. I feel like they'd be like, no, it was like, sounds like it was recorded in a garage. You don't want to hear that. I
Thomas Mooney 28:56
think like that's what like it was I think it
Shane Smith 28:58
was recorded in the garage. Pretty sure yeah, but it's a trip man. To total trip I had a box of those CDs and in a trailer they got like, the long story like we you know, I was saying I'm like super cheap as well. Earlier when you're talking about like, your uncle that's like trying to build a house. Yeah, save money or whatever. So I I had I had bought this trailer over Craigslist. And the whole thing was a little bit shady because I ran the serial number and and it came up as a red flag. I called the you know, I called on it. And so whoever I guess the comptroller or somebody I don't know and they're like, no, but it's actually not stolen. It's like a you know, it was something with an insurance claim but it should be cleared now. You know, it's good now. I got man sweet. Yeah, I got this trailer for Like next to nothing on Craigslist driving it, you know, I find myself like a year later in a parking lot in South Austin where I didn't have room to park it at my house. So I would go in every now and then I would have to park it at random places.
So there's like a Gold's Gym, in South Austin. That was my next victim, that I I parked it and my truck attached to it down there, and I came back and my truck had been broken into and like my first guitar was in the back like that it actually gotten like, destroyed from another gig where it got like, a speaker fell on it or something. Yeah. And but I was gonna save up one day and like, put it back together, you know. And so that was in there and like the soft case with all the pieces to it. And my golf bag and I had this like, golf bag and my dad found at a thrift store with all my clubs in it, but it was like a 1980s like Gatorade, lime green leather Gatorade bag that was just like, I mean, you know, unendurable on a golf course. And that was back there. All this stuff is stolen out of the back of my truck, right? I show up. I'm devastated. I'm like, Oh my god, dude, that guitar just got me through everything like, and, and it was totally just busted, like in pieces. And someone still stole it out in the back of my truck. And I was just like, they probably threw it in a ditch or something after realizing it was just broken. And it just meant the world to me. And so I was just devastated. I called the cops. He's like, Come over here. Let's run fingerprick so we're gonna find this airbag and I had like a box of those. I'll see the miles CDs. And I can't remember if they got stolen, or if they were the only thing that didn't get stolen. I got literally don't remember. So they either got a box of those CDs, or I don't somewhere I'm sure I do. But I showed up. That's not even the best part of this story is like, these cops show up new like, oh, man is gonna be tough, you know, will dry run finger brands, I run all these fingerprints. And they're like, how long have you on this trailer for? Like, why are you asking about the trailer opposite? I've owned it for legally for you know, like, a year and a half or something. And they're just like, Huh, it's what's coming up like, it's stolen like in like, you know, Kansas is like, Oh my god, you gotta be kidding me, dude. You're like, yeah, I'll call but you know, and they called, then the sheriff or whoever in charge, like called me back. It was like, hey, those are bad. Actually, one. You know, this or that? Whatever. I was like, Oh, thank God. Then I got another call back. And they're like, No, we were actually correct. It was a an insurance agency had paid out on a wreck that happened on it. But as you know, going into the paperwork, they owned the trailer at that point for paying out the damages. And they never received their trailer. Yeah. And this guy just had it as a storage shed, you know, in his bag was somewhere that he sold me on Craigslist, right? Yeah. They literally towed my trailer. They showed up because I had been robbed out of the trailer and out of my truck, all kinds of like precious items to me. My chainsaw, like all kinds of stuff, let alone My first guitar. And they proceed and not finding any fingerprints and towing my trailer. And literally reloading my trailer and I was just like, I give up on everything. There is no hope for me here. Yeah, and yeah. That's bad day. Yeah. I've gotten out of the well since then. Yeah, doing better. But one of
Thomas Mooney 34:26
these days you're gonna be watching golf on Sunday, and like Rickie Fowler is going to be having that. No one will believe me. God dang it. Yeah. That'd be like that. J day Rickie Fowler's got that, uh, it's very Seinfeld Ian in a way that he's not bright orange. He's lime green. Yeah.
Shane Smith 34:53
Yeah, but I don't know. I looked on Craigslist because I'm a Craigslist snob. Bro, I like your uncle. And I I went totally bird dogging for that game. Back. Dude. I look so hard for that thing, and I never found it. I need to get back on there because maybe now's the right time for him to post it. Yeah. You know, they're like out like, there's no way he's thinking about that. Right now. We can sell it now. Man. that's a
Thomas Mooney 35:29
that's a bad day right there. I don't know. I don't probably have anything to top that. So,
Shane Smith 35:35
I mean, that's pretty bad, right? I mean, I don't think I'm over drama. It's like you're getting up and
Thomas Mooney 35:42
you look up and the cops are just like, pushing you back down. Like No, no, we're gonna take this to Yeah, man. I thought you guys are like, they're
Shane Smith 35:51
like, What is going on? Sir, we're gonna have to take Yeah, and you got 50,000 unpaid parking tickets? You know, something like that? I don't know. Yeah. Just doing their job. I guess.
Thomas Mooney 36:05
That is. I guess that's the situation. Yeah, that's, uh,
Shane Smith 36:12
I feel like insurance companies get theirs. You know? I mean, it's like they got they got so much money. Like, come on. Let me have this terrible trailer.
Thomas Mooney 36:21
Yeah, right, right. Just insurance is always just the what would what would I call it? I think me and my buddies. This is back around High School. We were like, insurance is a white myth. Like, like, rich white people just convinced you that you needed to pay for insurance on everything. Yeah. And getting away with it forever. So
Shane Smith 36:43
yeah. That's like, look at the statistics of it. Like, it really doesn't add up for you. But I don't know. Whatever. Yeah, we're just gonna leave it. That's leave it alone.
Thomas Mooney 36:54
That's like an adult conversation that no one wants to hear. You're talking
Shane Smith 36:57
about? Hey, get out of here. They're letting that intern back here again. They let him out of his cage. Dustin six just walked by us.
Thomas Mooney 37:10
Yeah, no, he's, it's always funny. Like, these are not funny. But the street shows are so massive, and they're so hectic for you know, Dustin and Parker and Lance and Derek and like setting everything up, right. And by the end of the night, you don't even want to just like bother them. You want them to be like, just go take, I'm not gonna bother you. You guys got to be back here are you gonna be here for the rest of the night? Putting all this shit up, right. And the next day or the next week, you're like, you can tell that a street show just happened because you're just worn ragged by having to walk all over this damn place set stuff up, that people would really don't ever think about having to do you know,
Shane Smith 37:57
there's so much that goes into this stuff. That's why it's like so amazing. Having like a production company that will like set up and tear down everything again, like a company that'll come in set up and tear down everything like, right where you can just like, you know, wash your hands from the whole thing. But yeah, I'm excited. This is our first time ever doing a street show. You didn't know if you knew that or not. But we've never done one of these. And I mean, we're, we're very familiar with the blue light. We've played the blue light for years. And so it's like a it's like an honor to get to play a street show.
Thomas Mooney 38:35
Yeah, I was gonna say like, that's kind of like what I was leading up to is the like, the first time I saw y'all play, it was opening with American aquarium. And this was like a while back here. And Willie was American aquarium. And are open and so there was not a whole lot of people in yet. Yeah. But then the next time it felt like you guys were headlining on a Friday or Saturday, and it was just jam packed. And it's been that way forever. No sense like where it's like you got to get in line at Doors open at eight you have to get here at seven to get in line because there's only so many so much room in blue light. Yeah, and it's been that way for ever. It feels really cool thing.
Shane Smith 39:21
The blue light was I think the first place we realized that radio was like helping us because we promoted our first single was coast as a title track off that first album for us as a band and ended as one of those deals that we we realized that like Dave Wilde was just playing the hell out of it. You know, the ranch in Fort Worth was playing the hell out of it. And like all these people, like these gatekeepers and radio, like kind of legitimately like helped us out so much. And it was just the craziest thing in the world to show up to Lubbock. You know, excited that we He had an album to promote and that we had a radio single, Angela Lampton, was promoting us, like, there's a lot of exciting stuff for us going on. Right, then we're still really, we were very new to everything. And I remember we showed up to the blue light, and it was like, a sold out show. And we were just like, Oh my gosh, this is just so crazy. And because, like all that hard work of like, nobody giving a crap, you know, like, on Sixth Street or whatever, just for our sets back to back most nights and like, you know, and it's just no fans, you know, it's just, it's just people and you're just playing for passer bys. And you're, you're just background music or whatever, and to show up, and there's people like all singing the lyrics to that song is just like, it's just a really cool feeling. And it was at the blue light. Like, legit, it was at the blue light when we when that happened, for the first time for us. So it's one of those places, I'll always, you know, always remember, no matter how old I am, or whatever, I'll always remember this place as being that like, wait, this might work. Yeah, you know, like this might actually happen. Yeah, it was really neat. You know,
Thomas Mooney 41:20
a couple of podcasts back, I had Bruce Robison and Jacqueline Durand, and they were talking about, you know, early, like mid or late 90s, mid 90s, you know, they wouldn't be doing a podcast, they'd be at a radio station. And, like, there's no doubt that like radio was really, really, really fucking important. Oh, especially around the early 2000s. But, you know, obviously, the rise of Spotify and the rise of having everything on your phone, it's a, I guess, made spa, radio less important. But whenever you have those voices, like, like wild when he was at 105, now it's Jr. But especially like the ranch in Fort Worth, it feels like, those guys aren't just playing music, they're shaping an audience you to find the good stuff, you know, and that's your total, it's, it's more important than I think they may, they may realize or like, even just people in general, because like they're, and that's not a
Shane Smith 42:24
knock against them. But like, that might honestly be something that they might not even realize that how important it is that they take their selectiveness of music, like extremely important for the sake of this scene, and for the sake of its notoriety. You know, what I'm saying, from the outside, a lot of people look down on this scene from, you know, like, bigger, you know, there's, there's big stuff, obviously, outside of the scene, but the scene is like, so powerful, and it's so grassroots, and it's so cool, the way that it operates, and you know, these major stations for our scene, like, like the ranch, and it is, it truly is, like, so important like that they are, that they hold themselves to that regard and that and I think they do. But they hold themselves to that regard on on how selective they are, to what music they run. Because whatever they choose to run through there is what everyone in the rest of the world when they have a chance to look in on it. That is what shapes what the scene is, and if it's not legit, and they're still giving it spins or whatever, that's going to affect, you know, the scene as a whole and it's going to affect the overall perspective of what other people look at it, you know, and you know, it's a, it's a neat deal. It really is. It's it's a cool thing. Like it's just it. This state, you know, Texans are notorious for talking about Texas. Yeah, I get that. But like, it's a it's a really neat deal to see how this state like pulls together, whether it's for entertainment, and fun, whether it's for heartache and like disaster relief, right. I mean, it's like, it is just like amazing, I think and and, yeah, it's just one more reason I love it here.
Thomas Mooney 44:33
Yeah. Always like whenever I do think they care, like probably more than, like that bunch at the ranch probably cares more about what they're playing, then most stations do. And you can tell whenever, especially whenever they play something that they love, and they think is really, really good. And there's that one guy who's like this is in Texas country. And then Shane will be like, what may not be Texas country, but it's good music and like they defend good music, you know, even if it's not necessarily necessarily what used to go get drunk with. At 18 years old, you know what I mean? I get, I think the so important that they keep that too because the Texas country Red Dirt brand label the genre has expanded so much in the last 15 years, you know, I don't like I don't know if you guys would be considered Texas country or red dirt 15 years ago, you know what I mean? No, not at all. Even guys, like Turnpike. I mean, like, they they feel like there's, you guys have added so much of the roots music into the scene.
Shane Smith 45:54
I personally want to get away from that I really like you know, this isn't me being a jerk or anything. It's like, I personally want to get away from the term, Texas country and right and that thing, like the red dirt thing, I get it, you know, like the soil in the ground, I get it, you know, it's this area. But at the end of the day, it's so much bigger than that. Yeah. And it doesn't have to be pigeonholed the way that that pigeonholes it, it doesn't have to be Texas doesn't have to be just country. It doesn't have to be just red dirt. It doesn't. I mean, those are all amazing elements. But to me, it's like, what makes this so cool. And if there's somebody with the red dirt, organization.org or whatever, you know, what makes that person so cool. And what makes this the organization what makes that seen this whole thing that you call Texas country Red Dirt fan base, so cool, is the fact that it has an open ear to independent music, and gives independent artists the opportunity to have a platform have a legitimate career in music. That's what makes it so cool. Yeah. And it's you don't see it anywhere. We've toured like, you know, we haven't toured as much as a lot of bands. But we've toured like over 40 states or something like that in the last like, year, year and a half. Like, can we we've gotten to see a lot of stuff. And we've gotten to see a lot of festivals, we've gotten to see a lot of like, we've met so many bands, that's that's the biggest thing. We've met so many bands from so many different places. Every time we play in, you know, like Washington or Ohio or whatever, like there are bands opening those shows that are local. Yeah, that are talking to us before and after the show. They're like, hey, what can we do you think like to get out there? Whatever. They don't have what we have here, right? They don't? Yeah, it's non existent anywhere. And the it used to be existent with like the, you know, like the punk rock scene and like the it still is, I'm sure I'm not discrediting that at all. I'm sure it's like alive and, you know, thriving, I don't know, but it's like in the 90s what was happening with like, rock those rock bands like,
Thomas Mooney 48:14
Yeah, well, I felt like what it was back, it's probably still the same way is that the pockets of music are more city based, right, like Roxy, or like, obviously, New York, LA, the Seattle word of mouth couldn't spread by a can now but like now, Texas, what Texas has is more of the state infrastructure. While those places really have like the city infrastructure. I
Shane Smith 48:39
know what I mean. Yeah, you're totally, totally right. And that's a lot through college kids, right? Yeah. Universities and like kids going from small towns to big, big universities and just constantly jammin whatever at their parties and stuff. And everyone's like words that are I've never heard of that. I'm from New York and Milan, or I'm from LA or whatever, like, and that's what builds it. And that's what's so cool about like, what this scene, like, again, I'm talking all in present tense, right? Yeah. Okay, so forget even that aspect of how it's cool. Like, what it's done. Like we've sold out the last two shows in New York City that we've played there are only two shows we've ever played in New York City have been sold out. And, and that is like in the dead center of Lower Manhattan, like a legitimate venue. And that is all because of the scene. It's because people it's because like this fan base is so passionate about the music that it's open to and like, and it's like they don't go to shows they go to shows and they talk about it at work and they like burn a CD and send it to the cousin you know, they they send a song like a Spotify link to, you know, a group text and be like, y'all gotta check this song out. You know, they're gonna Blow up in the next couple of years or whatever, like, they are the reason that it like it thrives so much that and, and that is what causes us to even have success out of state. It that's how powerful the scene is. And it it to me, it pigeonholes the scene as a whole when you start to categorize it as things that are geographic, like red dirt, or things that are even genre, like, you know, country, X's country, like American aquarium, is one of the they're a great band within the scene, right? They're accepted within the scene, and they've done really well and like, you know, so, so his, you know, like black lilies and like, you know, Turnpike troubadours, obviously, Oklahoma and like, but there are so many bands that are itching Dude, I had a, I literally had a phone meeting the other day with a band that has opened for us in Washington. And I had two days ago, I think, three days ago. It's a guy that they're great band, they open for us in some tiny town in northern Washington, like, a year ago or something. And we had such a long conversation about like him saying, you know, man, it's like, y'all have such a cool thing down there. And it's like, we just, we don't know what to do. It's like, our hands are tied, we're playing these bars, but we're just background music up here. But like, our music would go over really well down there. It's like, what do we do? Like, should we get a radio promoter? And it just come down every now and then are like, should we do this or that or whatever. And it's like, that's a legit conversation that that I just had with somebody the other day, a follow up on that of like, how he can get his band, like, somehow exposed down here within this whole What do they call it? What's her? It's, I don't want to say it because, like, you know, I'm still talking to him about a bunch of other stuff. But like, it's it's big john cannon is, it's like, that he's up in. I'm trying to remember what the little town is. It's not Spokane, it's it's another little town up north of a couple hours north of Seattle, we played the first one Yakima, Washington and then went and did a show up there. And it was,
I don't know, it's just to me, it's just mind boggling, though. Like how, how much of an impact it has throughout other states, like all the way in Washington, you have this guy that's like, desperately wanting to get exposure down here and desperately wanting to, you know, have a conversation with someone down here and just like, talk about it, and like, what, what can we do? And like, how does it work down there? Like, do you get a promoter? Do you get a publicist? Do you do this? do you do that? And they're, like, so fascinated and interested, because it truly is, like, so unique and interesting. Like, you just, you just don't find it anywhere. And that's the same conversation we had in Ohio with a band that opened for us the same conversation we've had in, you know, like Maryland, and I mean, like, everywhere, like there are these bands that are so hungry, to get exposure and to be within a scene and like, get in front of fans and stuff is like where are they going to get that? You think they're gonna get it on radio? Hell, no. You think they're gonna get it? Like, I mean, they'll get it from doing what like American aquarium did. And they were about to break up as a band right before they did it. Right, because I couldn't make it happen. And then all of a sudden, they get in front of Turnpike troubadours in front of, you know, 1000 plus fans that are red dirt fans, and they're like, hell yeah, we'll accept that, too. This is awesome music, right? It doesn't matter where you're from, like, it shouldn't. It shouldn't. And, and I think it could be like, such a bigger scene, kind of, you know, it's like, people talk about the Americana scene and stuff. And that's, it's amazing. It's cool. It's been like 25 years in the making, or 30 years in the making something like that, probably. And they've done an incredible job. And it's really cool, but it's like, it's, it's like that. I mean, it's it could be something, you know, the Americana, you know, that's like, it's getting a Grammy now, you know, it's like yeah, and I mean that to be in to be that if you if you if you brand it in a way to where it doesn't pigeonhole itself and it doesn't, you know, geographically, you know, contain itself. And even in terms of genre contain itself, like, it's truly its own name. I mean, it could be as big as you ever want it to be. It's like there's a reason core one from Canada can come down here and do well get them it's because it's a it's a fan base of, of a bunch of really awesome people that are willing to listen to independent music and have an open ear to it, and not support it and buy a ticket, but go out and tell everyone they know about it to try whether they realize it or not to, to grow that scene in that infrastructure. And that's what's happened up to this point.
Thomas Mooney 55:14
Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting that with Texas music, I feel like right around the first time you hear Texas music, like, Are there any of these artists from Texas? The first time you heard like Pat green, or the first time you heard Randy Rogers, or anybody like that was like, for me, at least the first time I thought, there's a middle ground between being playing guitar at home and being like, Alan Jackson or George Strait. And, you know, everyone in Texas is basically an indie artist. And like, all these guys and girls, prove that you can. You there's a middle ground, you know what I mean? And that's something that like, I think a lot of people growing up, don't really realize that there's, you can be a working musician and make a living without being, you know, Stadium, rock, arena, rock level, you know what I mean? Of course, yeah. And so much of that is due to the infrastructure of Texas. Yeah. So
Shane Smith 56:22
you're totally right. I mean, I mean, that's a question we're having to ask ourselves right now with the with the album and stuff is like, Do you want to? What do you want to be? As a musician? What type of career Do you want to have? Do you want to, you know, try to be as big as you possibly can on like, a global scale, and like, sign with a label and like, do the whole thing with this album? Do you want to continue to be independent, but try to do it a different new way that's, like, cool, and gives you balance with your life. And, you know, it's like, there's so many different ways of going about it. And, and, yeah, that man at the end of the day, like, probably the most talented musicians that there are, you're not going to hear, like, you know, playing like, the biggest stage that there is a lot of times, you know, it's just because either reality sets in or they just, they just don't want to be famous. Or they, you know, they I don't know, it's just, it's a whole other conversation. But, but yeah, yeah, there's a lot of different ways of going about this. And, and, and you can do it whatever way you want. If you if you put a lot of work into it and you want to, you want to build a certain way, build it a certain way. You want to do it a whole different way, a different type of fan base. You want to, you know, be Mumford and Sons and, you know, pick and choose your, your tour dates based on you know, what stopovers they do is like a stopover is like a show for them like over in the States or somewhere. It's like they, they choose their cities that they're gonna have their stopovers at which every show is just a mini festival. It's literally like a miniature festival. They'll just bring all kinds of amazing bands onto the lineup and just have this killer thing. I went to one, Guthrie, Oklahoma. The reason it was a Guthrie, Oklahoma is because of the way they choose where what town they're going to have their stopovers in, is based on the economy, sending out bids of those towns, the most impoverished or like needing you know, yeah, financial help towns throughout the US. That's they literally took a huge tally of all these different cities, these different markets that they could have them in, and they chose the ones that it would help the community the most them bringing their concert to the town. So got through Oklahoma, I think sold like over a million dollars in ice within a day. Wow. Or something like that. Or like, a weekend or something. Yeah, and bags of ice. It's like, you know, you can go as far as that if you want to do your career. Yeah, you know, you could do it however you want to do it. There's a lot of different ways and a lot of people have found tons of success by literally just sticking in the state of Texas. A lot of people have found success by sign up with a label going down a long, tough road or a super fast, easy road. It's usually not but you know, there's so many ways of doing it.
Thomas Mooney 59:44
Yeah, with so much let's I don't know I will say this for the next one. Because I feel like if I say this right here, we'll go down the rabbit hole. But uh, yeah, well, we're gonna stop it right there. Alright, man. Yeah, well thank you so much for for sure. Dude, I
Shane Smith 1:00:02
appreciate you taking the time is good getting to catch up with you again?
Thomas Mooney 1:00:05
Yeah definitely. We're gonna I'm gonna start looking for those back that back that golf bag you can call me
Transcribed by https://otter.ai